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Victor
8th April 2002, 01:03
Everyone,

So quiet of late, why not discuss a kata and I'd propose Passai.

I'm aware that it has had many variations on Okinawa, and have seen more than a few different versions.

Which leaves me a question, why do you feel the changes were made?

I often think change was the real trademark of the Okinawan arts.

Perhaps this will create interesting thoughts.

Victor Smith
Bushi No Te Isshinryu

kusanku
8th April 2002, 06:57
I think henka are the essence of kata, henka of course being variations.

I am not sure any changes were purposely made in Passai, until about 1940 or so, I think Passai and other kata are seen , or were, in Okinawan and China, as more a series of drills to deal with situations , and Passai is a series of drills dealing primarily with being grabbed, reversing the grab and being re-reversed, and re-re-reversing:D that reversal , and so on, basically not a set-in-stone routine but a flowing series of wrist and arm locks, reversdals, escapes, and counters with counters to counters.

Like, Kansetsu waza drills done in Judo where, you grab me, and start an armbar, and I duck under and grab on to your arm,and you flow around my grab and regrab my arm and so on, up, down and around the tatami.No body really wins or loses, its a lock flow dril, and so is Passai.Possibly a set of lock flow drills.

So, this is how I look at the many, many different things called Passai/Bassai/Patsai.

Others however, may have differing pov's as always, and that's what discussion is for.I await of course the response from the ackroyd type that begins, 'You Pinhead!':D

PingAnTu
18th April 2002, 06:20
Passai is a fun kata. I don't know what versions you guys do but I do the tomari passai from the matsubayashi lineage. Passai and Chinto seem to be the most "kungfu-ee" of the lot. Passai reminds me of some kind of a karate-bagua hybrid. It has open handed techniques in the beginning with fluid direction changes (bagua) along with the quick direction change in the "low hammer, high hammer, crescent kick, elbow" section. I know it doesn't have anything to do with the actual style of bagua but there are some similarities in the theory of the movements. Unfortunately, I usually see people putting all kinds of static movements where it should be fluid?

Battousai
18th April 2002, 14:20
I think all katas change through what the student sees in them. What bunkai is evident to them. They subtlely change the kata from what their instructor taught, and then when they become instructors their students change it from what they have been taught. A recursive path.