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In-yo
19th October 2002, 15:36
I was advised to ask this question here for a better response seeing my question is regarding Ninjutsu.
I recently found a flyer for Kyu Shin Ryu Ninjutsu (AKA Kevin Hawthorn Ninjutsu) and wondered if it was ligit after doing a little search i found a style of ninjutsu with this name but apparently it died out years ago and the scrolls are now displayed in a museum? Can anyone else help me with this. When i inquired with the instructor i was told "Of course It's a real school of ninjutsu because we are a ryu not a Kai" I thought Kai meant society or similar and ryu meant school and as such would prove no bone fide?
Thank you in advance

John Lindsey
19th October 2002, 16:31
Kyu Shin Ryu is a modern, neo-ninja style. It has no connections to traditional Japanese ninjutsu.

BTW, I think there is a typo in the Secrets of the Samurai book in the chapter on ninjutsu. Instead of Kukishin-ryu, they say Kyu Shin ryu. I will check on this though. If true, I wonder if this is the reason for the name?

Baio
19th October 2002, 19:19
Maybe he's confusing kyushin ryu with Kishu ryu

In-yo
20th October 2002, 11:51
Thank-you all for your replies, it was as I thought
It was Kyu Shin ryu BTW.

Jitsumania
7th April 2006, 23:22
There are various styles of Kyu Shin Ryu. There is a european lineage of Kyu Shin Ryu Judo. There is also a lineage of Kyu Shin Ryu Karate which also exsits in europe. There are two Styles of Kyu Shin Ryu Aikijujitsu that are practiced in the USA as well. One style is more eclectic than the other but effective none the less. I have recently seen postings of Kyu SHin Ryu Ninjitsu but have yet to investigate it. As mentioned previosly, it may be a Neo modern Spin on traditional Ninjitsu.

kennin
8th April 2006, 00:10
When i inquired with the instructor i was told "Of course It's a real school of ninjutsu because we are a ryu not a Kai" I thought Kai meant society or similar and ryu meant school and as such would prove no bone fide?
Thank you in advance

Well, as much as I want to agree, I can't concur to this. Ryū means "school" indeed, but not as in "school building". It means "school" as in "style". Compare: "old school rap" for example. "Kai" or "kan" aren't "styles" but "organisations" or "federations".
I hope this helps?

This does NOT mean that the school you mentioned is genuine, by the way. It is most definitely not!

Hurtzdontit
8th April 2006, 11:16
Hi all,
I posted a reply to a similar thread like this a few weeks ago but it was closed for some reason. I live in Australia and used to live in Melbourne (kevs stomping grounds), almost everyone involved in MA knows that this gut is a fraud. He was a shotokan shodan in the 80's when the ninja boom hit, after that he was claiming to be a ninjutsu teacher before the Bujinkan or X kans had reached Australia, go to one of his classes now and you'll see its all karate in Ninja suits, they even wear the hoods for the warm up. Oh they also teach Okinawan weapons as well. Go check it out and get your Zen kutsu datchi on (karate stance), then check out one of the X kans or at least some footage on internet sites (I think genbukan.org has samples on their techniques page) and look at the HUGE diffrence.
Oh his website is
www.khninja.com.au
Thanks
Andrew Timms

Jock Armstrong
8th April 2006, 14:52
Kevin Hawthorne- blast from the past there!!. I didn't know the fraud was still going. Just goes to show you can never underestimate the gullibility of the paying public.............

Rubber Tanto
8th April 2006, 15:30
His school has had the hard word put on them lately. On another lesser forum, many people, in particular ex-practitioners, having been asking for evidence to back-up the statements and claims.
People asked for a pic of his menkyo kaiden (which he claims to have recieved), a pic of his master, a pic of the hombu dojo (which he claimed to visit regulurly), and even a pic of him training with his grandmaster. It even reduced to a map being posted of Kyu Shu island and a request to have the street, or at worst, area where the dojo was circled. Nothing came of it bar insults and death threats.

As an ex student myself, I looked at his bio and tried making a few enquiries. Everything seemed to point towards the school being fake

I'd give them a miss. A friend of mine went to watch a class, he said he watch a white belt sparring with a brown belt...full contact, no protective gear with BOKKEN!

That should give you an idea.