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O'Neill
11th December 2002, 22:32
I have read an interview with kuroda sensei and he keeps discussing "invisible" movements and Subtle movements, what would the japanese terms be for this kind of movement?> Thanks alot

Erin O'Neill

Daniel Lee
12th December 2002, 01:15
I've seen Kuroda-sensei refer to it as 'kieru ugoki' in his hiden magazine column.

O'Neill
12th December 2002, 23:38
Mr. Lee,

Can you translate that from Romaji to English for me? Take care.

Daniel Lee
13th December 2002, 02:23
'ugoki' is the noun form of the verb 'ugoku' (to move), while 'kieru' (to disappear) is the verb which modifies that noun :)

O'Neill
13th December 2002, 18:49
Thank you very much Mr. Lee

Erin O'Neill

O'Neill
13th December 2002, 19:06
I just came back from a seminar, and they covered kuzushi ittai or region of off balance (a rough translation). Does this sound right.
Or maybe I am mixing this up with point of off balance? Any idea?

Daniel Lee
13th December 2002, 23:02
Yes, you're right on the money about 'kuzushi' (break balance).

'ittai' (itsu 'one' + tai 'body'= ittai) in martial arts terms normally means 'whole body'. As a layman I haven't heard of this particular expression before - it might be style specific terminology. :)

O'Neill
14th December 2002, 17:21
They said that there is an alternate kanji that means region or zone.
Maybe that helps?

P Goldsbury
14th December 2002, 23:02
Originally posted by O'Neill
I have read an interview with kuroda sensei and he keeps discussing "invisible" movements and Subtle movements, what would the japanese terms be for this kind of movement?> Thanks alot

Erin O'Neill

Mr O'Neill,

My own reaction to this request is to ask for more information. Where was the interview? Was it a translation of an interview originally given in Japanese, with both generally available?

I ask because there is a huge range of possibilities with respect to the Japanese terms for 'invivible', 'subtle' and 'movement' and my experience with aikido is that 'movement' has a specialized meaning, not used in everyday Japanese.

For example, whereas 'kuzushi' has one character (), the meaning in ordinary Japanese is quite wide and there are at least six possibilities of how 'ittai' (with the initial character meaning 'one') can be written. The 'one body' compound has the meaning of being unified and the 'one region' compound is a geographical term.

Best regards,

O'Neill
16th December 2002, 15:53
They hinted (but didn't show) this region but said that it was an area that you lead uke to. A location in front or behind them, I was "guessing" that it was the same as the triangulation points taught in yanagi ryu. Maybe, who knows? They spoke of it but were'nt showing it.