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View Full Version : Ninpo - tested by you? Or by a guy 500 years ago?



Benjamin Peters
12th January 2003, 01:00
Following on from a thread I started Ninjutsu - traditional training: does it incoporate modern sport training? (http://www.e-budo.com/vbulletin/showthread.php?threadid=16327), I am left with the impression that drilling components of techniques is one way of attaining good combat skill. Drills, by my definition would be the breaking down and repetitive practice of techniques (or their components) so that they can be performed and reproduced with more chance.

As far as sparring is concerned, there are many arguements as to what is good or not.

My question is: Should we test our skills outside of regular training ie against people with different skills in a soughta NHB environment?

The fact is, the context in which the art was developed means that the art is (if it hasn't changed) dictated by one man's experience on the battlefield hundreds of years ago. Sure, these skills were used on the battlefield (the most useful came back with the practioner), so they were tested then, but what about now? How many of you have tested your skills recently - outside of regular (kata) styled practice?

It was mentioned in the original thread about BJJ and how, even as a sport kata (as such) were used. However, in such a dynamic game as BJJ, such kata need to be tested in a non-classroom environment - I'm beginning to feel that Ninpo needs to be the same.

Thoughts?

Kamiyama
12th January 2003, 05:36
Now u see Benjamin.. If I would have asked this I would have gotten hate mail.

At my Dojo we spar 'almost' every class. I say almost.
We warm up with "very light" upper body sparring. We go about 3 min then ad straight kicks to the midsection only for about 3 min.. Then we use upper body sparring with straight kicks to the mid section and getting to in-fighting. The use of range and how to tie up is the main subject of the warm-up. Which of course hides the warm-up. Knees, elbows, forearms, punches, pushing, pulling, takedowns and tackles are used in the in-fighting range.

No it is not pretty.
But effective training to help everyone underdtand fighting is not pretty and to run it you can from this mess.

After doing this for a few months and for a year or so you begin to get the picture of how to break the balance of the attacker, tie him up, hit inside, take him down and hit him standing-on your knees and on the ground without the BS that comes and goes in training. Most of all it's safe.

Mr Rick Ray 'Genbukan' always has very good training outline and I respect his views a great deal and I enjoy his post here. If I had his gift of writing I would almost say the same things he does. He has a very good grasp on the fight game. I would e-mail him directly and get him to cover some of his experience with you.

Good luck on your questions and answers.

kamiyama, ralph severe

Peter Holden
12th January 2003, 14:16
Originally posted by Benjamin Peters
My question is: Should we test our skills outside of regular training ie against people with different skills in a soughta NHB environment?

If you are young enough and fit enough then to raise your hand against other fighters in a test of skill, with taijutsu or swords, would be of benefit.

Budo and victory walk hand in hand as equal partners. A sportsman will be concerned only with victory and how to attain it. For a budoka victory is a natural result of years of hard work and dedicated training.

So first you must develop the skills which will lead to victory though training your body, your technique and your spirit. Start with skills of punching, kicking, ukemi and the Kihon Happo.

godstar
21st January 2003, 20:03
Originally posted by Benjamin Peters

My question is: Should we test our skills outside of regular training ie against people with different skills in a soughta NHB environment?
-snip-
Thoughts? [/B]


Ben My only problem is the confusion between, sport, sparring, and a real fight test.

A fight test puts you at the edge of your abilities and find out if your techniques are in harmony with survival instinct.

Anyway I have studied ninpo and 'it' does work for me the way we trained back in the 80's and 90's. I think Kamiyama has it right when you look at as a positioning exersize. But don't forget the more or less singular onness of flowing fight technique, look at a throw as a punch etc. and expand that way. And All this sparring is really just exersize, balance/positioning exersize etc.


Greg - daitoryu aikijujutsu