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View Full Version : Coke Pulls Swastika-Bearing Figurine



John Lindsey
1st May 2003, 03:46
http://asia.news.yahoo.com/030430/ap/d7qo49tg0.html

Soft drink giant Coca-Cola said Wednesday it has pulled a robot figurine adorned with what appear to be swastikas from a Hong Kong promotion following criticism from a local Jewish leader.

The company withdrew "Robowaru" from a promotional set of plastic figurines derived from the Japanese television series "Robocon," after Rabbi Yakkov Kermaier of Hong Kong complained, Coca-Cola spokesman Kelly Brooks said.

Robowaru has two swastika-like designs printed on its chest. "We regret any misunderstanding this may have caused," Brooks said in a telephone interview from Atlanta.

David Dunn
1st May 2003, 18:28
Good grief. Perhaps Shorinji Kempo should follow suit?

Shorinji manji (http://www.geocities.com/Athens/Agora/4807/manji/manji02/manji04.htm)

Tripitaka of AA
1st May 2003, 18:43
As we in Shorinji Kempo are aware, the symbol goes back hundreds of years (thousands?, not sure), and Hitler borrowed it from the Romans who borrowed it from the East (I presume). The symbol can be used both ways - with the top arm looking like a "7" or like an "F" - and is seen on Buddhist architecture across China and South East Asia. Next time you're looking at a Buddhist Temple, check the tiled roof, the end tiles often feature a Manji.


I'm guessing that the Rabbi was particularly upset by the use of the tilted Swastika, black on red, used on a robot that could appear to be "warlike" and which could therefore appear to celebrate the Nazi image. The doll uses the "F" shaped Manji (I've forgotten, is that Ura or Omote?), which the Nazis used exclusively and the colours are similar (Nazi used black on white circle with red background).

David Dunn
1st May 2003, 18:47
Actually David, I think the manji in various forms has appeared through European history too. My mum, who is a Scouter, says it used to be the symbol of the Scouts before WW2. The Isle of Man symbol is similar. There are whole books written on its history.

Adam Young
1st May 2003, 23:26
http://www.isle-of-man.com/interests/three-legs/index.shtml - regarding swastika-like symbols in Europe, and the Manx triskelion.

The four-pronged swastika may have a long history as a symbol of peace, but the Nazis spilled a ton of grape juice on that white cloth. Regardless of what it used to mean, in the West at least, there is only one thing people think of when they see the swastika.

Cheers.

poryu
2nd May 2003, 07:36
HI

I have british scout books going back to the 1920's and I have never seen a single mention of it at all in any of them.

The scout association has used the same Fleur de le logo since its creation in 1907

David Dunn
2nd May 2003, 09:24
Not sure if I could source it - just what my mum told me a long time ago. Might not be true.

David Dunn
2nd May 2003, 09:28
Paul, scratch that. First Google hit with "fylfot scouts", gets this, straight from the horse's mouth:
Baden-Powell's Thanks Badge (http://www.pinetreeweb.com/bp-can3.htm)

My guess is that it came to Europe through the ancient migration of the Indus people. Baden-Powell was possibly familiar with it from India. The manji is so imbued with 20th Century symbology that it is virtually impossible to discuss it rationally.

Chiburi
2nd May 2003, 12:37
Years ago I was shocked to see a Finnish fighter plane (from before WW2) bearing a swastika. I later learned that it's been used commonly in Finland and Europe for ages, before the Nazis decided to adopt it as their symbol. The "Finnish" swastika, if I recall correctly, only had the similar shape, not the colors. These days all swastika-like or Manji symbols seem to remind us of Hitler and the Nazis...

Putting a black swastika on a red Coca-Cola robot was one of the stupidiest moves by the Coke Company. The person(s) who designed that either had studied no European history or was very ignorant.

Cheers,

David Dunn
2nd May 2003, 13:13
You will notice the manji on Robotu is what we call 'ura' manji - the same orientation as Hitler's version. The usual way of depicting the manji in Shorinji Kempo is 'omote', the mirror image. We are taught that both faces are important. Manji represents (Confucian?) non-duality.

Example. Omote manji can sometimes represent 'ai' (love) and ura can represent 'riki' (strength), so the manji can symbolise the Shorinji Kempo characteristic "strength and love should not be separated (riki ai funi)", or as Doshin So put it "Strength without compassion is violence, but compassion without strength is impotent". His calligraphy of manji (no kata) on the dojo scroll adds the flourish to one of the legs, and is not symmetric, giving the image of it spinning. The additional meaning is continual change in the relationships between things. The symbol has much better meanings than those commonly held.

Shorinji Kempo dojo scroll (http://www.kbnet.co.uk/artemis/shorinji/manji0.jpg)

poryu
2nd May 2003, 14:15
Hi David

In the British Scout association book The policy, Organisation and rules of the scout association page 95 (published 1974) there is a picture of the Thanks badge as used then and I believe now. Its not a swastika, but the scout symbol in a cirlce with the words - with thanks in the circle.

I guess the one you found is the pre-war version or one not used in the Uk now. I spent 15 years in the Uk scouts and also some time with the Boy Scouts of America. and I never saw a Swastika on a uniform.

I would say after the war many people changed there use of the swastika.

My mother once told me about a pretty dress they had in there dressing up box which she and her sisters were never allowed to wear out side of the house. it was given to them by a relative who travelled in europe a lot in the 1930's. One day one of my aunties ran down the street in it being chased by my gran. The dress was destroyed. It was covered in swastika's and the date was around 1943

David Dunn
2nd May 2003, 15:45
Paul, I guess you'd have to go way back to see it in the scouts. The link I posted was by Baden-Powell, so probably turn of the last century.

seskoad
2nd May 2003, 16:41
the hindu balinese used swastika as part of their religion. 5 months ago, I went to bali and passed public elementary school, I saw two swastika symbol accompany the main plate on the gate. It was clearly to me that those swastikas symbol identitical with hitler's. But hindu had it long long long before the damn hitler.

Budoka 34
4th May 2003, 20:42
I believe the Navajo,Hopi and several other tribes(native american), also used the swastika as a religious emblem going back several thousand years.
I can't remeber the whole story, but I do remeber seeing an image in a book, of what was claimed to be an ancient hebrew emblem. It was a Star of David with a swastika at it's heart.

Anyone ever seen anything like that?

:smilejapa

Oda
6th May 2003, 20:39
Ok guys,

Ready for same ice hockey?
Windsor's swastikas (http://www.birthplaceofhockey.com/hockeyists/swastikas/pic-edmt-swas%201916.html)

And the legendary Thanks Badge in a better picture:
Thanks Badge (http://www.titanca.net/thank/thanksbadge.html)


Swastika is an old symbol used in Europe and Asia for a long time before the nazis. I don't think that the swastika symbol is a symbol of evil in any way. It all depends on the context where you see it. A swastika in a nazi flag gives you different feeling than a swastika in Japanese buddhist temple. Personally it doesn't give me creepy feelings to see count Erich von Rosen's personal symbol (swastika) in a WWII Finnish fighter plane. Though I have some friends who get annoyed by that and I find a bit odd.

Finnish Air Force in WWII (http://www.sci.fi/~ambush/faf/color.html)


Otto, you said you were shocked to see an image of the Finnish fighter bearing the swastika. Do you know that it was used by the army as well? Do you know that Finland's president has her own flag that bears a small "freedom cross" in its upper left corner.

Finnish presidential flag (http://www.d.kth.se/~d92-mau/Finland.html)

In the 60's France's president De Gaulle was honored with Finland's greatest military medal, the Mannerheim's cross. De Gaulle had some problems accepting the medal when he noticed that it had the same symbol he hated most: The swastika

Scroll down for Mannerheim's cross (http://www.lagus.org/medals_fin.html)

Tripitaka of AA
7th May 2003, 08:37
Those are brilliant links Oda, thanks very much for that.

The FAF WWII site is outstanding, people really love all those plane-spotting details don't they. So much detail and so lovingly presented. Must be a real enthusiast's site.

Anders Pettersson
7th May 2003, 10:36
Hi.

Here is another example of the use of manji (swastika).
Picture is from www.buddhistsupplies.com

Striking Hand
7th May 2003, 10:48
Hi All.

Here is a link to the original Bandai toy:

http://www.kaikodo.net/by2/122.html

Interesting point is that the manji is different.
;)

Anders Pettersson
7th May 2003, 11:48
Originally posted by Striking Hand
Hi All.

Here is a link to the original Bandai toy:

http://www.kaikodo.net/by2/122.html

Interesting point is that the manji is different.
;)
On the robot there is the ura manji (backside), which is said to be derived from the kanji for strenght (riki is one reading of this kanji: —Í )
In buddhismen the omote (front) version is mostly used, but it is not uncommon to also see the ura version as well.

Anyway it is not strange that a designer in Japan put a manji on anything (omote or ura) since it represents something totally different than what most of us here are used.


/Anders

KhawMengLee
9th May 2003, 09:00
Hmmnnn....crux gamma....

Being a Bhuddist myself I was brought up with the knowledge that the swastike represented the solar cycle. They flow both ways, the anti clockwise flow represented good/positive aspects as with the rise of the sun in the east and the setting in the west. The robot's swastika goes the other way representing destruction/chaos/etc.

I actually have a manji kamon on my bogu, specifically the Dou. No problems in Asia but in Australia a few people asked why do I have the Nazi symbol on...had to explain a lot.

Still, as said before the damned Nazis borrowed it and really tainted it. But I am not prepared to give up on my faith and culture just because of some scumdog bastard yahoos. Got to teach the masses the truth ;)

Joseph Svinth
10th May 2003, 03:17
Coke -- It's the Real Thing.

Or so the Bush daughters.

Prince Loeffler
10th May 2003, 04:42
Hey guys, if you don't mind I got several question..

About the manji's origin...Is it from okinawa ? Japan ? India or China ? Was this primary a religious or martial arts symbol ?

Thanks

seskoad
10th May 2003, 10:50
I think it's from India. Cause the balinese hindu use the symbol as well. And it is religious symbol. I think........

KhawMengLee
22nd May 2003, 03:23
India...sanskrit religious symbol. Waaaaay before Christ...