Spin off: from the "No blocks" thread

[bruceb]

There are parrys...

There are redirections ...

There are strikes....


But there are no blocks in karate .... unless you are looking to injury yourself?

Kicks? Well, that is a matter of learning reflex timeing to parry, redirect,or strike. In essence, if there are kicks, then there is imbalance present, and in the openings that present imbalance there is opportunity.

A person who is great at kicking has to be twice as fast because of the time it takes to present the kick and recover. This means, one should work on timeing to become as fast or faster than the kicker without kicking. When that happens .... there are more opportunities, aren't there?

As far as learning blocks .... forget about it, they are not blocks. Stop thinking in those terms because it is a dead end.

[CEB]

Originally posted by bruceb
...
But there are no blocks in karate ....

These statements of the absolute nature of Karate is based on what karate training? Who is your teacher? What is your rank? After all you present us with words that posess an authoritarian feel. We know you are a beginning grade student in Aikido. I'm curious what your karate background is since you seem to think you have a grasp on its true nature. Thank you for sharing with us.

[Sochin]

I split this so you two can have a chat here without interfering with the original topic...

Play nice or look for this in Bad Budo.


All others,

if you wnat to discuss 'blocks or no blocks' rather than credentials, go to the original 'blocks no blocks' thread by Prince...

[sepai 85]

uke tsuki itchi. In other word blocks and strikes are one. I am not just going to move your arm out of the way if I am forced to defend myself and trust me I do not fight but if someone threatens my life or the life of a loved one I will defend my self, if I am forced to do this I will inflict damage as I am blocking. One thing to keep in mind is blocking isnt always the standard jodan uke or chudan uke or whatever that is known as go no sen or retaking the initive. Another type of blocking is sen no sen or taking the initive what in the heck does that mean some might say. An example of sen no sen is my opponent is going for a high punch but I see it coming in so I beat his punch with a punch of my own therefor I have taken the initive from my opponent and thrown him of balance mentally and physically.

yours in shugyo

[Sochin]

Ben,

your post belongs in the other thread... see Prince's last post.

Repost it there, ok?

[bruceb]

Well ... CEB ... think about it.

You call them blocks, but what are they doing?

Are you redirecting to use that motion?
Are you striking to cause pain?
Are you parrying to get a better position?

If you are 'blocking' you are stopping the movement to do something, but what?

Why stop it? Why not use it?

Oh, by the way, I have, and continue to study, Kempo/ Jujitsu, but then again, right wrong or indifferent, every human being is entitled to an opinion, and this is mine.

If I am wrong, then prove me wrong? Been wrong before and I will be wrong again, part of life.... but for this one ... better take the attitude up with your teacher, because this is not opinion, there are no blocks, but the opinion of a a couple a hundred 4th - 8th dans. Maybe, your training has not reached this level yet, but it will .... someday.

In the meantime, don't get stuck on the word or application of blocks, because what starts out as a beginners level block soon changes into a transition point.

So .... somebody else want to give CEB a kinder heads up? I am a bit grumpy from a sore back .... not really in the mood for kindness right now ...

[Vapour]

If you engage in flame war with Mr Baker, your head might exlode. :saw:

[John Lindsey]

Blocking is not a Japanese word. I prefer to use the Japanese "uke" and not think about translating it.

[Prince Loeffler]

Ok Bruce ! if there are no blocks in karate then...In 50 words or less ...What would you call it ?

Please response to this before you run away and start up another thread.

And by the Way...CEB has been really cool to you until now...But you just seem to just fanatically enjoys stepping on other people's toes.

You don't have my sympathy. Therefore, I don't care what mood you're in today...Frankly you better start practicing what you preached.

[CEB]

I have not said anything about blocks period. I don't call them blocks. I have nothing in my syllabus called block. All my techniques use Japanese nomenclature. You mention 4th - 8th dans. Most us that you were addressing on this particular forum.... well we already fit into that demographic.

I was just curious what your qualifacations were to instruct all of us karate sensei here concerning the true nature of karate mechanics.

Actually what you had to say contains some truth and at the same time you demonstrate a lacking knowledge concerning keri waza. You can't help your are a novice. Well you probably could but that would take some effort and one hell of a patient teacher is my guess. If I agreed with you 100% I would still ask you for your point of reference for the views you throw out because you speak with an arrogant know it all tone. Unfortunate you continually demonstrate a knowledge base of some desperate wannabe.

I just wanted know what your point of reference was to come here and speak with authority concerning the nature of karate. My first experience with you was when you came to the Judo forum and told the Judo-ka we were wrong considering the nature of Judo. But it seems you aren't a Judo-ka either.

So you are grumpy and you aren't in the mood for kindness. Big whoop! I don't want your kindness and I certainly don't care about your respect. I think I stand on pretty good ground with most the individuals here whether I agree with them most of the time or not because I don't !!!!!!!! people. You on the other hand... well last time I saw I think your karma over 1200 in the hole.

Where I come from we refer to people like you as Kuchi Bushi. Maybe a kindly Budo-ka here can supply you with a translation of that. I'm done here.

[Goju Man]

Bruce, that is a really bold statement you made. Your definitions af block and parry are not correct. You are trying to interpret your "opinion" into words. You can smash your face with your opponents hand and call it a block but it isn't so. If you want to start your own "style" or art, you should at least have Yudansha staus for thirty years or so.

[Andy Watson]

Just in case you guys aren't familiar with the infamous BB, he normally haunts the Aiki or Members Lounge areas and likes to inflame people in argument and then claims that the reason that you are inflamed is that you have personality flaws which your martial arts training has not addressed. Therefore you are scum and not worthy to be called a martial artist.

Bruce however has far surpassed that level and is free to make whatever rash statements he wants without substantiating them or providing the viable evidence that he has the experience to know the answer.

Don't expect any direct answers to your points without being drawn into a written battle with someone who has problems with social interaction.

Good luck on your mission.

[Gene Williams]

I don't understand why anyone on any thread even responds to Bruce...if everyone, and I mean everyone, would just put him on their ignore list, he could run his mouth all he pleased and we wouldn't even know it. I never even know he exists now, except for his name popping up in a thread. Gene

[bruceb]

Too much attitude in Karate .... not good, not good.

I don't intend to be an umpteenth dan, nor do I care what dan anyone else is ... it is irrelevent. Why? Can't see belts in words, nor does calling me a big mouth nothing in Japanese reveal enlightenment for a post ... pretty dark soul some of you have to think like that, but ...

I have no problem for those who want their entire life to be pseudo Japanese as their practice uses more and more Japanese terminology, but then again, be careful .... in becoming thoroughly acquainted with Japanese symbols .... are you able to bring them back or interpret them into your native language and culture? You should be able to .... even if you are a beginner.

The other reason I have separated from the great Karate masters is the flaws they generally teach ... such as ... blocks? All the while the rhetoric is not to use force against force and the classes are teaching blocks? Go figure.

My buddy, Andy Watson, who I have not only insulted, but shamed into telling the truth on many an occasion on the Aikiweb.... Still angry? Oh, Well.

Stop being angry .... giving in to your emotional yearnings ... all of you, not just Andy ..... that is ... if this is truly a forum for martial arts, and you all are as advanced as you claim? Realize that westerners do not always teach the applications correctly, and we need to get rid of this term "block" because it is not at all correct. Except for the general term of keeping an object from reaching its destination, there are no such things as blocks in Karate. I really don't understand why a quote for some of my teachers is thought to be mine?

If you guys want to call them blocks, then define the term, the parameters that define blocks, and how they are applied before flaming off another post so we all have an idea what blocks are.

Interceptions or strikes would actually be more correct, eh?

If not ....well ... it is up to you to find your own damn answer. I have given mine, and it is not popular.

Oh well ....

Too much Attitude in the Karate forum for me .... back to obscurity where it is nice and quiet.

Bye.

[Goju Man]

The other reason I have separated from the great Karate masters is the flaws they generally teach ... such as ... blocks? All the while the rhetoric is not to use force against force and the classes are teaching blocks? Go figure.
Bruce. First off I don't like "blocking" as is presented in karate, I rather parry as the boxers do. I do however "block" on occasion due to the necessity of the situation, ie not seeing the attack in time or not reacting, etc. But I have many years not only training but putting my training to the test. For you to come on here and make such statements when you: 1 haven't trained in any "system" long enough. 2 not put any teachings you have had to the test. Anyone can be an arm chair quarterback in the comfy confines of your living room, but if you want to know the truth, get off the couch and on the feild. I may make statements that lord knows people have argued with me but cannot deny the validity of them, for they are proven. I may not train the same way or agree with some on here but there are some quality karateka on here whom have trained, in some cases half of their lives or more, and here comes BB with all the answers, who hasen't reached the level of proficiency in HIS art let alone another. I read you were also criticising an Aikido Master on another thread some time back, why don't you have your own school or following? A person with all the answers such as you would be an ultra hot comodity. All you have to do is back it up. I used to dislike the Gracies because of their cockiness, and sometimes percieved rudness, but respect them greatly because the can back up everything they say. My advise to you is, put up or shut up.

:smash:

[Sochin]

Guys,

he just failed the test - he was challenged and refused to stand up.

This is over, as anything else will just be rhetoric.