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Tom Smyth
28th May 2003, 13:31
We have tentatively scheduled a Katori Shinto Ryu seminar prior to the 4th Annual Orlando Tai Kai . This seminar will be taught by Takashi Masuda, Menkyo Kaiden under Tetsutaka Sugawara who is a former student of Risuke Otake and the current leader of Katori Shinto Ryu in Japan. We ( the promoters of the ta kai) are curious to know who might be interested in this seminar. If there is enough interest, we will plan to hold two seperate seminars.In case you where there, 2 years ago there was a tremndous bokuto fighting demonstration put on at the Orlando Tai Kai. This was performed by Takashi Masuda and his wife, Yumi.

Please post any comments you might have to this thread.

Thanks !!

Tom Smyth
Toyama Ryu Batto Jutsu
Seibukan Dojo

Mark A. Carter
28th May 2003, 14:36
under Tetsutaka Sugawara who is a former student of Risuke Otake and the current leader of Katori Shinto Ryu in Japan.

Hmm. This could ruffle some feathers - unless there was a big change in the political climate of the art?

Sounds like fun though, teach the Toyama crowd that discomfort can be taken to a whole new level - iai-goshi (sp?). ;)

gmellis
28th May 2003, 15:01
Who is the current "leader" of KSR in Japan? Sugawara or Otake? I wasn't sure what that last clause was modifying in the sentence.

Adam Young
28th May 2003, 17:02
This seminar will be taught by Takashi Masuda, Menkyo Kaiden under Tetsutaka Sugawara who is a former student of Risuke Otake and the current leader of Katori Shinto Ryu in Japan I'll give the poster the benefit of the doubt and just assume that he intended that the "and the current..." clause would refer to Otake sensei. Otherwise, it is just plain wrong.

It could also be incorrect in that I don't think "leader" is the proper word in this context either, but that could just be nit-picking. It is a fairly open work, meaning-wise, and unless the word is defined with some precision, it is open to misinterpretation.

Nonetheless, the purpose of the post (an announcement of information) was clear enough without running the small stuff through the wringer.

bob elder
28th May 2003, 19:25
We understand the prima donnas out there like to get bowed up about lineages and so forth. the current "leader" due to not knowing the correct term we understand is Otake sensei. the statement meant that Sugawara Sensei had at one time trained under the "current " leader Otake Sensei. Our belief is that if anyone in the arts has the basics down and a decent outlook they are plenty "authorized" to teach what they know. We would appreciate it is the computer warriors would keep this in a positive vein and realize Mr. Masuda will teach the version he learned and understands. Thanks for your time. Bob Elder current leader of nothing, thank God

Adam Young
28th May 2003, 22:00
Bob,

Please check your Private Mail.

notquitemusashi
29th May 2003, 02:20
Tom, i am will be there and i know of another iaidoka who will more than likely be going with if an Katori Shinto Ryu seminar is offered.

darren boylen

Dan Harden
29th May 2003, 07:54
Bob

**************
You said "It is our belief that if anyone in the arts has the basics down and a decent outlook they are plenty "authorized" to teach what they know."
**************

Fair enough.
I completely disagree, but fair enough if that is your view.
So tell me. If that is your method or standard of qualifying guest teachers......
Why mention the menkyo Kaiden.......?

What if many of us know the routine and know the art is not suppossed to be taught by unauthorized men regardless of skill? Do we then become complicent by that knowledge and our attendence?

TSKSR
There is only one Tenshin Shoden Katori Shinto ryu last time I checked. To join you make a promise.

Now
1. Since there is only one. And only one place to go to get Menkyo Kaiden...
2. Where did Sugawara Sensei get the full art to teach? He was not awarded Menkyo Kaiden
3. How does Masuda Sensei Obtain a Menkyo Kaiden from someone who does not have a menkyo Kaiden?


What does this mean to anyone? Apparently very little today.
But someone _bothered_ to mention a ranking.
No one asked them to. That was their choice?
Why?

Truth in advertizing?

Perhaps a one line explanation of what it is people will be attending and who they are going to see is not too much to ask.
Since this cat has long left the bag-is it fair to qualify the results of its depature to those who will be paying to greet it?


cheers
Dan

robin mcclaffer
30th May 2003, 23:34
Bob, I know the whole story from Otake himself he is not a happy camper about this. Maybe Carl will fill you in one day. Later, Robin

Maska
10th June 2003, 10:37
Good afternoon!
I am pupil Sugawara in TSKSR 4-th year. First he too seem to me not so. But the more I at him am engaged, the I understand more, that it is not worse the fencer than Otake.
Now passes his(its) seminar in Moscow

Charlie Kondek
11th June 2003, 14:07
Welcome, Maska, and thanks for your input.

Forgive me for pointing it out, but you must sign your full name when you post.

Regardless, welcome!

Tom Smyth
11th June 2003, 15:50
Hey you can only hang me once for not getting the message right.. After that is no fun...

Didnt mean to get everyone's dander up..

Geezzz.

Tom Smyth:eek:

Finny
15th June 2003, 06:40
Tom... Its got nothing to do with getting the message (wording) right.

You can't make a wrong message right through semantics.

Its got nothing to do with "is not the worse fencer than Otake(sic)"

Like Dan said, there is ONE TSKSR. It is one of the oldest, most traditionally structured arts still around. Certainly is one of the most famous of the koryu.

As with most koryu, there is a strict licensing process involved in training. Only an authorised teacher can teach TSKSR. A teacher can only be authorised by Otake Risuke Shihan.

Sugawara was not authorised to teach by Otake sensei.

Takashi Masuda was not authorised to teach by Otake sensei.

People can get all elaborate with liberal ideas about "teaching what they know", but the fact is Otake sensei, through Iizasa soke, IS TSKSR.

There are no "competing factions", or alternative routes.

Surely as Bob Elder said, we can teach and show what we know whenever we want, BUT we cant teach and show TSKSR if we're not qualified to do so.

The End.

(PS sorry for long post)

Shimura
21st June 2003, 15:48
I'll try to make it if possible, work permitting, and I'll ask if any of the other iai guys want to go as well. What are the dates?

Gary MacMullen
Aikido of West Florida

Tom Smyth
21st June 2003, 18:40
I have had quite a bit of positive feedback from folks very interested in attending this seminar. For the dates please go to www.toyama-ryu.com and click on the 2003 tai kai button. It is listed under the seminars.

Tom Smyth