PDA

View Full Version : formidable British force been poised to invade the American market



PeteBoyes
24th July 2003, 08:16
A question for those of you on the West coast of the USofA - Did you notice there was some real 'football' being played at the Seahawks stadium ?

Well, did you see it ? Apparently, it had a 'record crowd' of around 67,000.

A guy in the Canadian press reckons
Not since the United States shook off its colonial governors in the War of Independence has such a formidable British force been poised to invade the American market.

His full story is here http://canada.com/sports/story.html?id=87578E99-FD59-4615-8494-691BD89CF6DE but it's really annoying how he refers to the mightiest team in the world as Man U

Have you been shaken by this formidable force ? Or did it not even register a hiccup on the vast network of seismographs over there ?

For those of you who missed it, United are playing in LA on Sunday.

A. M. Jauregui
24th July 2003, 09:36
No I did not catch it, but will see if I can pick up tickets for the LA area match. My dad really loves soccer and it would be a wonderful early birthday present. Aww no Beckham...

larsen_huw
24th July 2003, 09:36
I can't see Man U making much of an impact over there. For a start the name football is already taken over there .... although the name goes with a game where "foot" and "ball" come in to contact on an infrequent basis. Possibly less than 15-20 times a game.

Don't get me wrong, i like watching american football, and have nothing against it, i just think it's an odd name.

Although if you took my arguement that the foot and ball rarely come into contact to its (il)logical conclusion, you'd get the game of:

BigFatB*****dBigFatB*****d

hmmmm ..... maybe back to the drawing board on that one! :D

As an aside: MAN UTD ARE SCUM! ARSENAL FOREVER!

Senjojutsu
24th July 2003, 12:15
Real football in America opened training camps this week.

The annual great Darwinian struggle within the "Not For Long" league has commenced.

Let the games begin (soon) so we can get basebore off the tubes.

After all, America's love of this violent territorialistic carnage of a sport is one of the reasons why the USA is the world's only superpower.
:)

I know this opinion bothers the soccer metrosexuals, but I call it as I see it.

As boring as several of the 37 Super Bowls have been (kill the halftime shows) at least no Super Bowl ever played to a zero-zero tie at the end of regulation.

larsen_huw
24th July 2003, 12:22
Does a game have to have scoring in it for it to be interesting/exciting?

Can't near misses (hitting the post, drive stopped on the 1yd line etc.) be just as exciting as actualy goals/touchdowns?

Surely it's this tension that makes games exciting, not the scoring? The highest scoring game i can think of is cricket .... and that can be a huge yawnathon!

Still can't really understand why you call it football, but then every language has it's quirks to it.

tb055
24th July 2003, 12:28
Cricket, a game can last for 5 days and end in a draw!

A. M. Jauregui
24th July 2003, 12:52
Originally posted by larsen_huw
As an aside: MAN UTD ARE SCUM! ARSENAL FOREVER!

Blah, Newcastle United is where is it at. ;)

elder999
24th July 2003, 22:39
Play soccer...

CKohalyk
25th July 2003, 01:41
I dunno if they'll make that much of an impact(other than established soccer fans). The US lost to Brazil in the Gold Cup recently and it didn't even make a ripple in the news. The MLS is alive and well but draw nowhere near the fans of any Prem team. If the domestic league gets no attention I doubt the English league, or any other for that matter will. Plus the way football is organized, it is much different than baseball or amefuto (American Football). There is so much more to keep track of! (If you are into the English league for example) Premiership, Euro, UEFA, Champions League, plus transfers to French, Italian, Spanish, German, or Scandinavian leagues... and then International fixtures on top of that. That's a lot to digest.

But football just got its wings in the 90's in the US... it takes time.

And footballers are not lawn fairies. I have no idea why on Mike's thread (http://www.e-budo.com/vbulletin/showthread.php?threadid=20531) football is lower than BASKETBALL!! I mean, how manly are SLAP-FIGHTS!?!?!? I'll take a good spiking over that any day!! ;)

That's all for me,

ck

Oh yeah.. Chelski RULEZ!!!!!!!!!

Shitoryu Dude
25th July 2003, 02:18
Hate to break it to you, but it was mostly a pack of foreigners who showed up. Barely made the news and nobody cared.

:beer:

Julian Gerhart
25th July 2003, 03:57
Originally posted by PeteBoyes
A question for those of you on the West coast of the USofA - Did you notice there was some real 'football' being played at the Seahawks stadium ?

Well, did you see it ? Apparently, it had a 'record crowd' of around 67,000.

A guy in the Canadian press reckons

His full story is here http://canada.com/sports/story.html?id=87578E99-FD59-4615-8494-691BD89CF6DE but it's really annoying how he refers to the mightiest team in the world as Man U

Have you been shaken by this formidable force ? Or did it not even register a hiccup on the vast network of seismographs over there ?

For those of you who missed it, United are playing in LA on Sunday.

It did register more than a hiccup in Seattle. possibly a string of hiccups or even as much as a small sneeze or stutter. there was a good amount of coverage in both the newspaper and the televised news leading up to, and after the game. It sold out at least a few days before game day. However I believe that most of the ticket sales came from foreiners and not from native western washington residents.

Shitoryu Dude
25th July 2003, 05:35
On the whole, Americans consider soccer to be a kids game. As a general rule we are not interested as we find the game boring and wimpy. The event was covered slightly for a day or two, nobody I knew of talked about in the slightest bit - not a single word.

But I also find baseball to be boring and wimpy and reportedly there are people in the US who watch it, though to look at the empty stadiums you'd never guess so. I personally think baseball is fast becoming a dying "sport" in this country. It is more popular in other countries, and played better by them as well. Just check the roster of any major league team and you'll see that most of the better players are from outher countries. Give it a few decades and the player's strikes combined with outrageous free agent salaries and numerous foreign players will kill MLB in the US.

:beer:

Soulend
25th July 2003, 10:26
With the possible exception of rugby, I think all sports played with a ball are boring (to watch) in the extreme. When I hear of people actually rioting over some game, it just boggles my mind that so many could get worked up over something so meaningless and vapid.
I'd take a good light or middleweight boxing match over any of 'em.

Harvey's right, though. Most people I know are oblivious to soccer.

John McCollum
25th July 2003, 19:42
Originally posted by Soulend
With the possible exception of rugby, I think all sports played with a ball are boring (to watch) in the extreme.

Frankly, I've always found it really odd that to make progress in a rugby game, you can either pass the ball backwards or kick the ball out of the park. Mental.

I think that's enough from a gutted Celtic fan :cry:

Soulend
25th July 2003, 19:45
Provided there's enough bloodletting, the bizarre gameplay can be overlooked. :D

Shitoryu Dude
25th July 2003, 19:52
About the only ball game that I'll watch is American football, and not very much of that. I think I've watched a total of 5 games over the last dozen years.

To actually sit down and watch a sport - sumo highlights are good. I'll watch karate matches of course, and sometimes boxing if the fighters are ready to get in there and pound the hell out of each other for 3 rounds. Basketball - boring, baseball - watching grass grow, hockey - more of a Canadian thing to me, soccer - snore, rugby - nobody plays that here and it seems too much like soccer. I have to admit that I pretty much do not have the sports watching gene.

:beer:

John McCollum
25th July 2003, 20:04
Just out of interest, has anyone here caught any of the NFL Europe stuff this year? The claymores play five minutes from me in Hampden Park and I managed to get to four games this year. They put on huuuuge amounts of publicity this year and the game's gaining in popularity. Opportunities to see NFL games on TV are very limited here - anyone care to comment on how big the gap in quality is between NFLE and the NFL?

Oh, and if anyone has a spare three hours, you can see the Claymores thump Berlin here (http://www.nfleurope.com/multimedia/2003/week1/04052003_video.html)

:D

Shitoryu Dude
25th July 2003, 21:02
Second hand info only; I heard that the NFLE was at least as good as American college football. Is it true that some NFL players are also in the NFLE?

I'd like to see the two leagues play off each other to some extent. It would be a hoot if Europe beat us at our own game.

:beer:

John McCollum
26th July 2003, 16:44
Originally posted by Shitoryu Dude
Is it true that some NFL players are also in the NFLE?



The NFLE is owned and operated by the NFL primarily as a means of promoting the game in Europe. The game is most popular in Germany: not surprising given the American military presence there.

Although national players do play in each team (ie Scottish players playing for the Scottish Claymores) most players are young, up and coming guys who have been shipped over here for the experience. Some are free agents looking to display their talents. (Look out for Ken Simonton in the future ;)) Most belong to an NFL franchise.

Shitoryu Dude
27th July 2003, 06:18
.

seskoad
27th July 2003, 10:46
[i]
As an aside: MAN UTD ARE SCUM! ARSENAL FOREVER! [/B]

yeahhhhhhhhhhhhhh...............yuppyyyyyyyyyyy....... gooner forever

ScottUK
27th July 2003, 15:15
"Baseball: A bunch of farmers standing around, scratching their nuts and looking for flyballs"

- James Woods in 'Any Given Sunday'.

I have two ballsport loves:

1 - NY Giants v Anybody
2 - England's National football team v the French, the Germans, the Spanish, the Dutch etc etc.

seskoad
27th July 2003, 20:53
My most hated sport game list:

1. Australian football
2. Rugby
3. Cricket
4. ...

My most favourite sport game list:
1. Soccer
2. Soccer
3. Soccer
4. and so on....

;)

Chidokan
27th July 2003, 23:21
isnt american football just rugby in armour with loads of breaks for adverts???? i'd like to see the australian rugby squad take on a team like the Giants...could be interesting to watch... no armour of course as that is for wimps and girlies.:D

Tim Hamilton

Soulend
27th July 2003, 23:36
Would definately be interesting...

http://www.ballsout.com/art_rugbynfl.htm

ScottUK
28th July 2003, 01:40
i'd like to see the australian rugby squad take on a team like the Giants...Ah, Tim, tim, tim,

You've fallen into that trap like many of our fellow countrymen.

I used to play American football for the local team here (nose tackle and tight end for those who care!) and I have to say that AF was much more physically demanding than rugby. Sure, rugger is very demanding, but when you put 110% into every sprint, every blitz, every goal line defense (defence for us Brits) after a matter of minutes, you're relying on pure adrenaline to muster the strength to murder the fullback you've got your eye on. :D

Pads? Sure - they're for pussies. If you play rugby the way it was meant WITHOUT pads, it'd be tough. If you played AF WITHOUT pads, it'd be a hard game to survive.

In rugby you tackle. In AF you HIT.

Anyone got stats on injuries, taking into account that AF players are generally better prepared/equipped for injury due to experience/fitness/etc etc?

Chidokan
28th July 2003, 02:24
errr, thats how we play rugby up north...we hit not tackle..:D

Tim Hamilton

Shitoryu Dude
28th July 2003, 02:33
There was an interesting article a while back where a Brit soccer player worked out with an American Football team for a day. Some of the things he noticed was that

A) Football players are HUGE
B) They are a lot faster than you think they are
C) All that padding is needed if you want to live, or at least remained moderately uninjured
D) They were in fantastic physical condition
E) It was one hell of a lot harder than he thought it would be

All that said, he was in damned good condition himself and most likely could have been trained to make a good football player himself. Of course, he wanted to see a few American Football players train with a pro soccer team for a day. ;)

I think the one thing that many non-Americans don't realize is that your typical college or pro football play comes in extra-large sizes only. I've known a couple of ex-pro players and All-American college boys. They start in at 250 pounds (100 kilos) of solid muscle and go up from there. Pro ball players are statistically larger than well over 99.99% of the general population.

ScottUK
28th July 2003, 03:00
...and they're obviously mad.

Lawrence Taylor:

Taylor created the outside linebacker position in his own image. He was 6-foot-4 and 240 pounds of athletic fury, a Butkus with wheels. Fast enough to cover receivers, strong enough to bully offensive linemen, able to leap tall buildings in a single bound. And heaven help any quarterback who got in his way.

.....

Before games against Washington, Giants coach Bill Parcells would tell Taylor the Redskins didn't think he could play anymore. No matter how often he'd heard it, the tactic always worked.

.....

Taylor was part of arguably the most gruesome televised moment in NFL history. He crashed in and landed on the back of Joe Theismann's knee on a "Monday Night Football" game in 1985. The Redskins quarterback's shin snapped forward like it had a hinge in the middle. Taylor immediately jumped up and started motioning for help.

.....

He once suffered a concussion, and the Giants trainer had to hide his helmet to keep him from going back in the game.

.....

The Saints were 9-3 and the Giants were playing without quarterback Phil Simms and All-Pro linebackers Harry Carson and Carl Banks, both injured. Taylor had torn shoulder ligaments and a detached pectoral muscle, but he strapped on a harness and had seven tackles, including three sacks, and two forced fumbles. The Giants won, 13-12.

...and he was only ranked 40th best athlete!

http://espn.go.com/sportscentury/features/00016489.html

Soulend
28th July 2003, 03:22
Yeah, much as I love rugby, I would have to agree that rugby players would be crushed. You just can't be run over by 250 and 300 pound men the way they hit and continue to walk around. The pads and helmets are neccesary to ensure that players will survive to the next game.

When I was an assistant coach for my son's soccer team, one of the volunteer coaches we had was a monster...like some sort of bizarre cross between Arnold Schwartzenegger and a tyrannosaurus. He played football (lineman) for Western Carolina U., and was at one time being looked at for the Jets. He hit like a runaway freight train. Unfortunately, they told him, he was too small. :eek:

Shitoryu Dude
28th July 2003, 04:04
A guy I worked with, Oscar something or another, was 3rd string linebacker for the Oilers during the mid-80's, Oscar was a bit nuts (too many steroids is what he told us) but stood around 6'4" and weighed in around 325. After a couple years with Houston he either got cut from the team or quit and took up being security for Guns & Roses for a few tours. Oscar liked to inflict pain - lots of it.

One day after work we all headed into this bar next to the Colorado State campus for a few brews. The doorman reached his arm around Oscar's neck, lifted him up into the air several inches and proceeded to give him a noogie. The two of them traded backslaps that you could feel 10 feet away. The doorman was around 7 feet tall and was just this walking, blonde, brick wall that weighed around 400 pounds.

Oscar ordered up a round and told us that the doorman was going be 1st string when he got drafted in a year or two.

:beer:

John McCollum
28th July 2003, 10:29
Here's (http://www.miami.com/mld/miamiherald/sports/6162963.htm) a copy of the story mentioned above where David James trains with the Dolphins. Very interesting reading.

larsen_huw
28th July 2003, 11:22
How big are american football players in the minor/sunday league teams? I assume they're more normally sized than the huge hulks seen the the pro leagues.

Is there much of a grass roots american football following? Do friends meet up in the park after school/work to play football? Over here, a jumpers-for-goalposts approach is taken by kids (and kids at heart!) all over the country. Go to any park when it isn't raining and you'll usually see a spontaneous game of football (our type - soccer) has been started using piles of jackets/jumpers for goalposts. Can that sort of thing happen in the USA, with all the equipment you need for a game? Is there some agreed standard of 'light contact' for when all the padding and helmets aren't available? Or do you just throw the ball back and forth in a non-competitive sort of way?

Nothing against american football (other than all the advert breaks on TV!), just never seen it be done down at the most basic level.

And a big well done for my university side, the Surrey Stingers for winning their BUSA league.

ScottUK
28th July 2003, 11:31
There's peewee games and upwards, both in the States and over here.

Non-Contact Versions

Touch football - two hands on a player signifys a tackle...
Flag football - grab a flag attached to a players belt (easy!) and he's tackled...

larsen_huw
28th July 2003, 11:38
Thanks for the info Scott,

I can imagine the 'touch football' game suffering from Cowboys & Indians syndrome. The 'i got both hands on you before you passed - no you didn't - yes i did' thing. Possibly slightly clearer with the flag version, but not by much.

PeteBoyes
1st August 2003, 08:22
A record crowd attended in Seattle, another record (79,005) were at Giants Stadium last night. They're guaranteed a record on Sunday in Philadelphia since it will be the inaugural game at the stadium :)

But I guess the real indicator is the TV audience ? Are they all at the ground because there is no TV coverage ?

A. M. Jauregui
1st August 2003, 09:59
I read about the record breaking numbers in Seattle the other day in the Sunday paper.

Not a big TV watcher but a friend of mine did tell me about watching it so I assume that it is shown.