Kyu/Dan spellings

[jodirren]

Okay, what are the proper spellings for Japanese belt ranks in the kyu/dan system? I'm having a real hard time figuring it out and would like to get it straight so as to not contribute to the chaos that is out there. Here's the way I best figure it goes, from lowest to highest:

jukyu
kukyu
hachikyu
shichikyu (nanakyu?)
rokkyu (rokyu? rokukyu?)
gokyu
yonkyu (shikyu?)
sankyu
nikkyu (nikyu?)
ikkyu
shodan
nidan
sandan
yondan (shidan?)
godan
rokudan
shichidan (nanadan?)
hachidan
kudan
judan

The ones in parenthesis are other alternatives I've considered. So is this correct?

I understand that shi is also how the kanji for death is read, so apparently, for superstitious reasons, the pronunciations of shi and shichi (4 and 7, resepectively) are avoided. Thus, it makes sense that you see yonkyu and not shikyu. However, I hardly ever see nanadan and almost always see shichidan, which seems to be inconsistent when compared with the number 4. What gives? Bad translation, or is there some exception here?

Also, what's the deal with the double k's in nikkyu and rokkyu? Should they technically be double k's or not? And is it rokukyu or rokkyu/rokyu?

So confusing .....

Much thanks in advance to those who can help out.

jd

[Brian Griffin]

Originally posted by jodirren
I understand that shi is also how the kanji for death is read, Right...different kanji, both pronounced "shi."

so apparently, for superstitious reasons, the pronunciations of shi and shichi (4 and 7, resepectively) are avoided. Thus, it makes sense that you see yonkyu and not shikyu. However, I hardly ever see nanadan and almost always see shichidan, which seems to be inconsistent when compared with the number 4. What gives? Bad translation, or is there some exception here?nanadan and shichidan are used interchangeably and seem to be equally acceptable.
I've never seen or heard anyone use shikyu nor shidan, and I would avoid them entirely.

Also, what's the deal with the double k's in nikkyu and rokkyu? Should they technically be double k's or not? And is it rokukyu or rokkyu/rokyu?There's a phonetic change that occurs when certain syllables combine, especially syllables that end in -chi, -ki/-ku, and -tsu when followed by certain initial consonants. I can't give a comprehensive rule (anybody?), but I will offer some examples:

ichi + kyu = ikkyu
(note that both 'K's are pronounced--in practice that means a glottal stop follows the first 'K' sound)

roku + kyu = rokkyu

HOWEVER: ni + kyu = nikyu
(no double 'K' since ni doesn't end in one of the required sounds)

tetsu + ken = tekken
tetsu + sen = tessen

satsu + katsu = sakkatsu
katsu + satsu = kassatsu

hachi + ho = happo
roku + ho = roppo

Theoretically, hachi + kyu = hakkyu, but I've never run into it. Besides, Kano thought six kyu were plenty ;)

'Shichikyu' probably wouldn't be contracted, because 'shikkyu' would sound just as offensive as 'shikyu.'