PDA

View Full Version : Your best Japanese Martial Art film?



S.Jubei
6th October 2003, 03:55
I have been interested in Japanese Martial Arts film's for years and have seen quite a few in my time.
Some of the best i have seen yet are probally some of Akira Kurasawas films such as Seven Samurai, Yojimbo, Sanjuro etc. I also enjoyed more modern films such as Owls castle and Samurai fiction.
But the best i have seen has to be the Samurai trilogy that dipicts Musashi's life played by Toshiro Mifune (a legend in my view). These films are simply called Samurai 1-3. I found these three films gripping and couldnt take my eyes off the screen.
Has anyone else seen it or seen any other film they would like to share?

I would like to know other peoples views on there fav Japanese films and why so maybe i and others can look out for them.

Thanks

Shimura
6th October 2003, 17:13
I can't think of any other movies besides the one's you mentioned. I will have to agree though that the Samurai trilogy is the best series of Japanese martial arts films I've ever seen. The last with the duel with Kojiro was inspiring, to say the least.:D

Shorite
6th October 2003, 17:42
I agree with you both, the Samurai trilogy was gripping and an intense drama. but when it comes to movies, for me, nothing is better than a bit of cheesie violence. For that "Shogun's Assassin" does it. Its a cross of the first two movies from the Lone Wolf and Cub series, cleverly edited to make one story line. very cool. I've heard that Duel to the Death is good, i am trying to get hold of that at this moment.

Budoka 34
6th October 2003, 18:25
I love the Samurai trilogy and the Seven Samurai! We get together several times a year and watch them all; along with one of my favorite films "Sword of Doom"!

When we want something more modern, we watch "GoJoe", "Taboo", or "Owl Castle"


:smilejapa

Shimura
6th October 2003, 18:33
The homosexual tone in Taboo makes it my least favorite, though I must admit the sword fighting was rather good.

don
6th October 2003, 19:14
I thought the duel at the end of Dangerous Liasons, albeit not Jpn, was some of the finest fight choreography on film. In so much we see, it's one climax after another with every opponent a deadly encounter. But in Dangerous Liasons, we could see the older master (John Malkovich) dallying with the young challenger (Keanu Reeves?) who has more enthusiasm than talent.

But I agree with the first poster, Mifune Toshiro is the man.

JimmyCrow
6th October 2003, 19:27
I always liked Japanese films that feature the kind, compassionate, humble to a fault Samural. Seven Samurai is the best of them all but I also liked Ame Agaru (After the Rain) and The Twilight Samurai.

The final duel scene in Twilight Samurai will answer any questions you might have about wearing swords indoors.

The ninjas in Samurai Fiction are pretty funny too.

MarkF
7th October 2003, 10:51
If you like Kurosawa films, you should see his first film, "Sanshiro Sugata." In the US, it was released as "Judo Saga." It is from the novel Sanshiro Sugata but has never been published in English. The film is subtitled, though. It was written by the son of one of the Shitteno (Four Heavenly Lords) of the Kodokan, and is loosely based on the life of one of them, Shiro Saigo, considered to be one the greatest judoka ever. The writer's father was one of the combatant's in the first of the really great shi-ni-ai against the best from the jujutsu styles around at the time (1895).

The film was first made in 1943 and as it was war time, it was heavily censored, but it showed the promise of a young Kurosawa, not to mention a great scene in which "Yano" is attacked by a crowd of jujutsu hooligans, where he promptly chunks them into the river one after the other. While this film is considered fiction, it is better-described as non-fiction fiction. That one scene provides the essence of what the local jujutsu dojo of the day was like and what Kano wanted to change in his version of jujutsu.

Later, in 1965, a remake was make starring Toshiro Mifune as Prof. Yano (based on Prof. Jigoro Kano, founder of Kodokan Judo), and has far more action, the stuff mainly cut from the original version. The problem: Only the original version made in 1943 is available. Check Towerrecords.com or any other video store. It is usually available but difficult to keep in stock.

You just need a little imagination to get out of the first version, what the second leaves in (also directed by Kurosawa).

I've heard that there was another remake in the 1950s, but so far I've not found anything on that to make the rumors true.


Mark

Earl Hartman
7th October 2003, 20:26
Sorry to disagree with everybody, but the "Samurai Trilogy" with Mifune absolutely blows. One of the worst trumped-up pastiches of samurai kitsch ever made. It looks nice and all, but that's it. But then, most of Inagaki's films are like that: very pretty but strictly formulaic. For some reason, Mifune is nothing but a daikon yakusha in almost all of his non-Kurosawa films (when he's directed by Kurosawa he has no rival).

"Sword of Fury" with Takashi Hideki is much better if you're into Musashi. The characer of Takuan in this version is especially good. I have heard that there are two other versions starring Nakamura Kinnosuke and Mikuni Rentaro, but I haven't seen them.

If you like spectacle, try "Samurai Banners" (Furin Kazan) and Chushingura, both directed by Inagaki. In the fomrer, Mifune plays Yamamoto Kansuke, Takeda Shingen's military advisor, and in the latter he plays a ronin spearman called Tawaraboshi Genba. A great, over-the-top, scenery-chewing turn. Both films are very lavish and pretty to look at. Chushingura is saved by the stature and skill of the actors playing Oishi and Kira.

For sheer body count, it is hard to top Sword of Doom and Samurai Rebellion. Of course, anything and everything by Kurosawa is worth watching over and over again. However, IMNSHO, one of the best and most poignant period films is Seppuku (Harakiri), starring Nakadai Tatsuya, directed by Kobayashi. A great film.

Of course, then there is all of the various cut-em-ups that are too numerous to mention. I remember liking Katsu Shintaro in some of the Wolf With Cub flicks, but for some reason I got tired of them.

S.Jubei
8th October 2003, 08:58
Originally posted by Earl Hartman
Sorry to disagree with everybody, but the "Samurai Trilogy" with Mifune absolutely blows. One of the worst trumped-up pastiches of samurai kitsch ever made. It looks nice and all, but that's it. But then, most of Inagaki's films are like that: very pretty but strictly formulaic. For some reason, Mifune is nothing but a daikon yakusha in almost all of his non-Kurosawa films (when he's directed by Kurosawa he has no rival).

"Sword of Fury" with Takashi Hideki is much better if you're into Musashi. The characer of Takuan in this version is especially good. I have heard that there are two other versions starring Nakamura Kinnosuke and Mikuni Rentaro, but I haven't seen them.

If you like spectacle, try "Samurai Banners" (Furin Kazan) and Chushingura, both directed by Inagaki. In the fomrer, Mifune plays Yamamoto Kansuke, Takeda Shingen's military advisor, and in the latter he plays a ronin spearman called Tawaraboshi Genba. A great, over-the-top, scenery-chewing turn. Both films are very lavish and pretty to look at. Chushingura is saved by the stature and skill of the actors playing Oishi and Kira.

For sheer body count, it is hard to top Sword of Doom and Samurai Rebellion. Of course, anything and everything by Kurosawa is worth watching over and over again. However, IMNSHO, one of the best and most poignant period films is Seppuku (Harakiri), starring Nakadai Tatsuya, directed by Kobayashi. A great film.

Of course, then there is all of the various cut-em-ups that are too numerous to mention. I remember liking Katsu Shintaro in some of the Wolf With Cub flicks, but for some reason I got tired of them.

Wow, great i'll have to check some of those out.
I like the sound of Chushingura, sounds top notch.

Thanks

Brian Owens
8th October 2003, 10:06
I definitely second the motion on Chushingura! The story of the 47 Loyal Retainers is one of the great folk stories of Japan. And in the film version we get the lavish costumes, the huge sets, etc.

The role for Toshiro Mifune, very brief and mostly at the beginning and end, was likely added to draw an audience. There was really nothing pivotal in the story-line that depended on his character. Still, I always like seeing him.

I also recommend Gate of Hell. It is one of the few good films I've seen that deals with pre-Edo period Japan. I believe it was supposed to be the Heian period, but I'm not sure. In one of the sword fights the combatants are using tachi, one handed, and it is an interesting contrast to the katana swordplay normally seen.

If you like Toshiro Mifune, there is a B-grade East-Meets-West movie called Red Sun that you might enjoy. Mifune plays a samurai in the last days of the Edo period who comes to America to escort the Japanese Ambassador. Charles Bronson plays a train robber who gets captured by Mifune and forced to lead him to his ex-partner who stole a ceremonial sword that was to be a gift to the President of the US.

Another East-Meets-West film that I really liked is The Yakuza with Robert Michum and Takakura Ken. This one is set in the 1970s (yes, the 1970s) and has a great story line with some good swordplay.

Some of these may no longer be available for purchase, but you may be able to rent them or buy used copies on Amazon.com.

Good post! Let's have some more suggestions everyone (subtitled or dubbed, please. I don't speak Japanese :()

Scott Irey
8th October 2003, 16:32
Hitogiri or Tenchu as it is titled here (not sure why they changed one Japanese title for another Japanese title) is my favorite. Absolutely a must see for fans of Katsu Shintaro and practitioners of any of the Tosa sword traditions.

Regards,

Steve_Himebaugh
8th October 2003, 18:03
One of my favorite Japanese martial arts movie series is "Zatoichi, the Blind Swordsman". Zatoichi has skills that would make Daredevil envious. Zatoichi not a samurai, but yakuza. He wanders around Japan supporting himself with gambling and massages. He uses a hidden sword in his cane.

Can't recommend it for learning Japanese swordmanship. Zatoichi uses an unorthodox reverse grip. The sword work is entertaining.

However, I like the Zatoichi character. The plots are interesting. And, I enjoyed the presentation of the historical period.

There's even a movie in the series "Zatoichi vs Yojimbo" where Zatoichi crosses swords with the Toshiro Mifune as Yojimbo.

A bit of Zatoichi trivia, the Zatoichi actor Shintaro Katsu was producer of some (all?) of the Lone Wolf and Cub movies. Shintaro Katsu brother is Wakayama Tomisaburo who plays the main character Itto Ogami in the Lone Wolf series.

Zatoichi was showing on the International Film Channel as part of their Samurai Saturdays promotion.

Earl Hartman
8th October 2003, 23:33
Right, it was Wakayama Tomisaburo that I was thinking of. I remember one flick where he stays for the night in a temple, and all of the Buddhist stautes in the temple turn into ninjas, and he just slices and dices them all to ribbons. Very spooky and very cool. Anybody remember the name of that flick?

"Tenchu" sounds interesting. Is it the one where Mifune plays an assassin who kills Lord Ii? I aslo remember "Gate of Hell". It was a good flick, but I never thought of it as a swordfighting movie in particular.

Also, there are about a bazilion versions of Chushingura, what with it being the national epic of Japan and all.

I remember when Inagaki's version came out; it was in 1962 and I was 10 years old; it played for an entire year at the local art-house cinema. My parents took me to see it and I fell asleep. When I mention to Japanese people of my generation that this particular version was one of the films that put Japanese cinema on the map in the US (the others being Gate of Hell and Rashomon) they burst out laughing. Why? Because Asano was played by Kayama Yuzo, who was sort of the Pat Boone of Japan, a popular singing idol who starred in a lot of Japanese teen bobby-sox-type films, sort of the Japanese versions of the Annette Funicello/Frankie Avalon "Beach Blanket Bingo" movies. They thought it was hilarious that Americans were so impressed by a movie starring a teen hearthrob rather than a serious actor. However, the Oishi and Kira parts are played by Kabuki-trained actors, and it shows. As formulaic as it is, I still get a kick out of it.

When I was in high school I used to go to Japantown and watch a lot of B/W ninja and chanbara flicks, the names of which I don't remember at all. I remember them being very cool, though. There was one where a young swordsman develops a technique for winning where he cuts off the thumbs of his opponents so they can no longer hold their swords. But he turns evil and so his friend fights him to prevent him from killing any more. The evil swordsman kills his friend but loses his own thumbs in the process. I think this flick has an appearance by Musashi who cuts a tatami mat from side to side on the quick draw; the young swordsman who eventually turns evil outdoes him by cutting a tatami from end to end on the quick draw. I was only about 15 at the time, but I thought the sword work was way cool. It seems to me that the older films definitely have better sword work; I think the older actors were better trained.

The only film I remember from that period was a B/W ninja flick called "Warring Clans" (the Japanese tile was Sengoku Yarou) starring Kayama Yuzo. Anybody know this one?

Oh, yeah, any chanbara starring Ichikawa Raizo, especially the Nemuri Kyoshiro series, is going to be good. The Nemuri Kyoishiro series is the essence of real Japanese chanbara: a lot of killing and lurid sex with heaping dollops of S&M and nihilism.

Brian Owens
9th October 2003, 00:03
Originally posted by Earl Hartman
I aslo remember "Gate of Hell". It was a good flick, but I never thought of it as a swordfighting movie in particular.

That's true. I guess the post was "Best Japanese Martial Art film" wasn't it.

Being a Yankee who's never been to Japan, I tend to lump all Japanese period pieces together with martial arts films. They all evoke the same sensation for me.

Scott Irey
9th October 2003, 00:30
Originally posted by Earl Hartman

"Tenchu" sounds interesting. Is it the one where Mifune plays an assassin who kills Lord Ii? I aslo remember "Gate of Hell". It was a good flick, but I never thought of it as a swordfighting movie in particular.



Katsu plays a low level Tosa samurai who is a hired sword for one of the factions in Kyoto during the time leading up to the Meiji restoration. It co-stars Yukio Mishima as a Satsuma hired sword. Mishima commits seppuku in the movie (about a year before he actually did) this freaked the Japanese out (a little too close to real life apparently) and the movie has not been that popular consequently.

Not the "best" sword play (by chanbara standards) but some of the most realistic...not very fair... not very pretty...just the way I like it.

:D

Earl Hartman
9th October 2003, 00:44
Actually, I forgot a couple:

Shinsengumi (aka "Band of Assassins") w/Mifune as Kondo Isami. I remember it being extremely gory, with the swordfighting being depicted as very down-and-dirty.

Kiru (Kill!) a flick from the '60s directed by Okamoto Kihachi. I don't remember much about this film other than that I enjoyed it immensely when I first saw it all those years ago.

Budoka 34
9th October 2003, 12:11
I finially found and rented Samurai Fiction.:D
I liked it.:) Strange but interesting.

:smilejapa

dingodog1
26th February 2004, 18:01
Originally posted by Budoka 34
I love the Samurai trilogy and the Seven Samurai! We get together several times a year and watch them all; along with one of my favorite films "Sword of Doom"!

When we want something more modern, we watch "GoJoe", "Taboo", or "Owl Castle"


:smilejapa Hello, Budoka 34, where in NC are you located. I'm in Charlotte. Do you belong to a school or club that gets together and views the movies?

dingodog1
26th February 2004, 18:12
There was another thread on E-budo where we spoke of the admiration we had for the Zatoichi movies. I have copies of at least ten of them and they lasted between 1hr. 15 minutes to an hour and a half.
There was also a series though, also starring Shintaro Katsu as Zatoichi. Does anyone know how many movies there were, how many episodes of the TV series there were and the length of the episodes?

Also, there was an episode where Toshiro Mifune reprised his role from "Yojimbo" and it is considered a classic in the Zatoichi collection. Does anyone know the name or names of this episode as they often had two separate titles?

I'm certain someone on e-budo knows the answers to these queries. If not now, someone will eventually so here's thanking you in advance.

dingodog1
26th February 2004, 18:24
There was a really nice show called "Rurouni Kenshin" being shown on the Cartoon Network here in Charlotte. The plots were pretty good but after about maybe ten episodes it was abruptly pulled and I haven't seen it since. The protagonist' name was Himura, "The Battosai", and he was baaad with his sword. He was basically the Champion of one faction that resisted the Meiji(sp) around the time of "The Last Samurai"; swore to never kill again and had to defend his peaceful friends and himself from his old enemies who refused to let him cease to be a "manslayer".

Brian Owens
27th February 2004, 07:47
Originally posted by dingodog1
...Also, there was an episode where Toshiro Mifune reprised his role from "Yojimbo" and it is considered a classic in the Zatoichi collection. Does anyone know the name or names of this episode as they often had two separate titles?
I have this one on VHS. The other Zatoichi films I have are in cardboard covers, but this one is in a deluxe plastic case. That suggested that it was considered special, and after watching it, I agree. I like them all, but this is my favorite.

It's called Zatoichi Meets Yojimbo in English, and Zatoichi To Yojimbo in Japanese.

c. 1970 Toho Co., Ltd. Color. English subtitles. 115 minutes.

dingodog1
27th February 2004, 14:16
I knew it. Thank you, very much!

Chrono
11th March 2004, 02:37
Originally posted by S.Jubei

But the best i have seen has to be the Samurai trilogy that dipicts Musashi's life played by Toshiro Mifune (a legend in my view). These films are simply called Samurai 1-3.

I'm sure I'm a bit late asking this, but where did you get the videos? I plan on getting them myself, but I'm not sure if I can get them with subtitles and with the correct region for the DVD player.

Jon

Brian Owens
11th March 2004, 03:31
Originally posted by Chrono
I'm sure I'm a bit late asking this, but where did you get the videos? I plan on getting them myself, but I'm not sure if I can get them with subtitles and with the correct region for the DVD player.Available at Amazon.com, in Region 1 (USA & Canada) only at this time. Japanese language with English subtitles. Full Screen format. Here're the details:

Samurai Trilogy @ Amazon.com (http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg/detail/-/0780021045/103-1017318-7450204?v=glance&s=dvd&n=507846&vi=tech-info)

Jeff Hamacher
11th March 2004, 04:29
Originally posted by JimmyCrow
... but I also liked Ame Agaru (After the Rain) and The Twilight Samurai. The final duel scene in Twilight Samurai will answer any questions you might have about wearing swords indoors.

LOL! how true. Twilight Samurai (Tasogare Seibee) features Sanada Hiroyuki, the "village martial arts teacher" from The Last Samurai. not only is he an excellent actor, but his martial skill is quite astounding. (too bad the film didn't get the nod at the Oscars, but as a Canadian, i have to support the choice of The Barbarian Invasions.) Ame Agaru is equally good for its fight scenes and also features some great actors, including Mifune's son as a sharp-tongued feudal lord.

Chrono
11th March 2004, 04:40
I should have checked out Amazon before I asked. They have everything, so why not that? Sorry guys.

Jon

Brian Owens
11th March 2004, 04:44
Originally posted by Chrono
...Sorry guys...
No need to apologize; what're friends for?

Besides, it brought this thread back to the top, so more members can be aware of it. That's always cool, man! :cool:

Tomo
11th March 2004, 09:57
Look out for the 'Beat' Takeshi version of 'Zatoichi' which features some fun stuff. Overall the film has a great sense of humour as well as the obligatory fight scenes.

But I just can't settle to Zatoichi's backhand grip.

For me the 'classic' duels are in Kurosawa - Seven Samurai, Sanjuro, and so on.

Full marks to Gohatto, however, for delineating the difference in style in the dojo and in the street, and different styles within the dojo. I particularly liked the hard clash of bokken in one match, and then the softer and closer work in the next - you know who's sword would last longer!

And Takeshi's character is a back-street fighter par excellence - no style at all, but I wouldn't like to go against him!

Thomas