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MarkF
9th October 2000, 09:34
This one, especially compared to hon kesa gatame, seems to have more body control than it's close relative(s), as you could, at least, see most attempts to escape and adjust accordingly. Is there an escape which is comparable to escaping the standard kesa gatame?

Mark

Jeff Cook
9th October 2000, 21:12
Mark, good question!

First, assuming the opponent is holding me down from my right side, I would have to clear my left arm and bring it under his right armpit, causing him to move into standard kesa. Then, I would forcefully pull my right elbow towards the ground, simultaneously turning my body towards him, also simultaneously grabbing him at the belt on his back and pushing him away from me while shifting my hips away from him. I have to get my right elbow to the ground at all costs, that's my priority.

Then, while holding his hips away with my left hand, still on his back grasping his belt, I will then jack-knife my legs over so my pelvis is "belly-down." Again, I cannot do this if my right elbow has not cleared to the floor.

After the jack-knife move, I continue to move my hips away until we are almost in a sixty-nine position (my belly is still to the floor), which will allow my head to pop out from under his arm. As soon as my head pops free, I come up to my knees, pull him towards me/me towards him with my left hand still on his belt, I trap his right arm with my right hand, throw my left leg over his head and swing my hips around into juji gatame.

I know I went a little bit beyond the escape, but with this version of the escape, the opportunity for juji gatame usually presents itself.

Jeff Cook
Wabujitsu



[Edited by Jeff Cook on 10-11-2000 at 05:20 AM]

kusanku
10th October 2000, 00:47
Jeff, good answer, too!:-)

Mark, of course, in any newaza escape or kaesi waza, the first thing, as Jeff said, is to get some kind of clearance by whaatever legal means. Got to get that arm free, got to roll the opponent, or roll out from under(turn out) as in westling too, in the opposite direction.

Once that is there the arm bar,ude gatame, is okay, and can be cobined with the shime waza, or you can go from there to the sankau jime if he flips over on his back and tries to sit up.

It all depends on the realative weight, size and strength and skill of you and the oppoent, as to how this can play out.

But I think,you ave to create some motion in your own body, to shake loose some gap and get some clearance, then you can work.

If in any kind of kesa, they hold your head well clear of the mat, you can't bridge out, and if they keep really tight chest contact, you are going to have some trouble with this first step.

If they are really applying pressure,its a matter of trying to sense where the weak point in their body structure is and move against that with all possible leverage.

But I tell you, I've had people slap on basic kesa, and been unable to move. Okay, it was a sixth dan, but the point was made quite clearly, this can be done.

Fwiw, I always had more luck escaping from various kesa, hold, by turning out from under and going for the arm bar.Then securing it, I would roll up te arm under the armpit(mine) and sit into them, with their arm leverd u and pressure downward.

Once I got that, No one, any where near my rank, ever got out.But then, in a prone armbar, flly on and with elbow hyperextended, I never got out either, time to tap.

That's how Allen Coage got his arm broken in a match once, and I remember hearing the story from someone, and took that leson real well.

MarkF
11th October 2000, 09:56
That is interesting about Coage. I hadn't known about that.

The first thing I learned about defending any gatame waza, was to relax and breathe for a few seconds. But this is tricky, if you don't have the advantage first, in other words, space. If you have been fighting it off for a while, gathering yourself may be very important. "OK, he's got me. Now what?"

Jeff,
Your post describes an old adage "for every move there is a counter move," in this case, a reversal. Space becomes a friend, the clock your enemy, as is my preference in katami waza, a choke or arm lock, as you described. It is more comforting to know the opponent will tap, or else.:)

I cannot add anymore. Your descriptions about cover this one. The arm lock, either way, is there, but you must take advantage of it, especially these days, when there is less time to react. Go for the arm.:)

Mark

efb8th
17th October 2000, 07:22
Hi, Guys.

Kudo's DYNAMIC JUDO: GRAPPLING TECHNIQUES describes two escapes from Kuzure Kesa Gatame:

1. Bring both heels close to your buttocks. At the same time, flip your body up and twist your hips to the right. put your left fist at the base of your opponent's throat, stretch out both legs, and pull your right elbow free.

2. If you have attempted to push your opponent back by twisting your body to the left and he has put his right hand out forward and on the floor, slip your right hand under his right arm, and push it away and over your own head. At the same time, twist your body to the right, thrust your chest and abdomen tight up against your opponent's back, and draw your right elbow free.

Kudo suggests you follow up with a choke called Katate Kata-ashi jime (one-hand-one-foot choke) which is too slick for church camp! Perhaps another time.

Regards,