Returning family blades...

[BigJon]

Are there groups, who track down Japanese sword/knives and arrange to return them back for the family? I have heard something about this in the past. I ask this because I have a tanto blade, that is written with a personal message on it. It also has kanji etched on the topmost portion of the blade. I believe that it was originally a sword, it may have been broken and reshaped into the tanto. I was given the blade when I was very young. I now feel, I should see if I can find a descendant of the original owner. When I have time, I will put up a scan of the front and back of it.

Thank you for any replies.

[Jock Armstrong]

Be real careful big J!! Most of these people are into a big scam where they get the blades for next to nothing from well meaning people like you or me and then sell them in Japan for a massive profit. About ten years ago they got sprung by the authorities in US and Australia. They were yakuza financed and advertised in papers claiming to be returning blades to families- it was all hogwash. If anyone contacts, ask to be put in touch directly with the family. If you have an old blade, get it checked out and then ask the Japanese consulate for help. They may be able to track someone for you.

Good luck

PS If I had a good blade theres no way I'd send it back!!

[Ye Olde corpse]

If i could get proof of that it was the correcct family, i would return it if they still practised some form of martial art. Otherwise, i think i would actually keep it.....

[BigJon]

Thanks for the replies. Jock, I understand your warning...thank you. I have heard of 'legit' groups, but the scammers are always the better known ones.

[Shimura]

See if you can get a number of the legitimate NBTHK in Tokyo. I had one in one of my sword books, and as soon as I find it I'll post here for you. I know that they were working in conjuction with the US Military at the end of the war in returning some blades to their families.

[glad2bhere]

This may not come out exactly right, but my question is, "what difference does it make?"

About two years ago I worked with an individual in Japan to return a sword and a company flag. It was a bit of a challenge and took some time and effort but the items made it back to Japan. Now, I could agonize over whether someone took those items and sold them in a bazaar or antique store or sold them for scrap, but the fact is that they got as far as I could send them. If the Japanese people themselves do not respect these items, why is it that we as Westerners should work harder than they for the safeguarding of these items?

On the other hand, if you want to make a Wagnerian opera out of trying to repatriate this item, knock yourself out. Just remember that it may, quite likely, turn out to be something akin to trying to return a piece from the American Civil War to the family of the Confederate soldier from which it was taken. Lotsa luck.

Best Wishes,

Bruce

[DCPan]

Hi,

I heard some stories about a electronics (TV, stereo, etc) shop in Southern Cal buying up old blades from veterans for next to nothing then returning them to families in Japan for a sum of $$$, then use that money to buy inventory to sell on this end...is it a make believe story???

:D

[BigJon]

On the other hand, if you want to make a Wagnerian opera out of trying to repatriate this item, knock yourself out. Just remember that it may, quite likely, turn out to be something akin to trying to return a piece from the American Civil War to the family of the Confederate soldier from which it was taken. Lotsa luck

Thanks Mr. Poopy pants!, What does a Hapkido guy even care about Japanese blades? Oh, that's right, I forgot that most Korean stylists are busy copying Japanese arts anyway...have fun with your kum do practice, and no your **** came out just fine...

[pgsmith]

For what it's worth (not much I know), I tend to agree with Bruce. It's possible that what you have is a treasured family heirloom that the family would be deeply grateful to have returned. It is more likely that if the family could be found, they would have no clue that this heirloom existed.

I think your first step should be to have the writing that exists translated. Their are several on this forum that could do that for you if you got pictures.

Cheers,

[glad2bhere]

Dear Jon:

"......Thanks Mr. Poopy pants!, What does a Hapkido guy even care about Japanese blades? Oh, that's right, I forgot that most Korean stylists are busy copying Japanese arts anyway...have fun with your kum do practice, and no your **** came out just fine..."

A.) The caring stems from the fact that all Mu-do or Bu-do derive from the same crying need to develop lethal skills while simultaneously developing the character to use those skills discriminatively, if at all. Its called "character development here in the West.

B.) As far as your assertion that Koreans copy Japanese arts, it may be of some help to know that Korean martial science and Japanese martial science have a history of inter-dependence going back more than a millenia or more.

Not that either of these facts may be of the least interest to you nor the fact that I have already engaged in the activity in which you are interested and might better have been a resource. As it stands perhaps you might take your narcissistic conundrum to a venue whose participants reflect your own level of maturity, mayhaps to find someone who cares if you successfully resolve your problem or not.

Regards,

Bruce

[John Lindsey]

While not a sword per se, other things do get returned to Japan:

[cxt]

Glad2bhere

May not be the right place or may be exacttly the right place.

But I was wondering if you could expand a bit on on exactly how/why

that Japanese and Korean martial "sciences" are somehow interdependet.

Other than the importation of Korean swords at one historical period I was unaware of the Korean influence in Japanese koryu arts.

I was aware that other than the deeply revisonist folks. Modern Korean arts TKD/Hapkido/Kumdo etc are directly taken from Japanese sources.

Chris Thomas

[glad2bhere]

Dear Chris:

"......But I was wondering if you could expand a bit on on exactly how/why

that Japanese and Korean martial "sciences" are somehow interdependet.

Other than the importation of Korean swords at one historical period I was unaware of the Korean influence in Japanese koryu arts.

I was aware that other than the deeply revisonist folks. Modern Korean arts TKD/Hapkido/Kumdo etc are directly taken from Japanese sources......"

Certainly it depends on which end of the timeline one cares to start at.

If we begin at the THREE KINGDOM period (C. 300-700ad) there is the emigration of culture from the Paekshe and Kaya kingdoms as well as considerable trade with the Silla kingdom. The thousands of mound bruials found on the western coastal areas attest to the cultural influence of these emigres, the metalurgy of the Three Jewels of the Japanese emperor and the genetic material carried in his line that derives in part from Korean (or "continental forebearers")

If we begin at the latest era we, of course, have the various arts promulgated by the Japanese during their occupation of the Korean peninsula and Manchuria prior to and during the Second WW. However, the influence of both the Chinese Ming and Ching dynasties, inter-dependence among the Buddhist traditions of Korean monasteries with their counterparts in Northern China as well as continual incursions by peoples such as the Jurgeons across the northern borders have been as influential as any intercourse with Japan over the centuries. In this way the Japanese as much as benefited from the Korean culture by absconding with Korean smithes, Korean potters and Korean religious artifacts over the centuries as the Koreans benefitted from Japanese items going the other way.

Most people like to speak of the effect of Japanese tradition on Korea as a one-way street and I suppose it is easy to be seduced by this thinking if one keeps to that period of time exclusively after 1894. In fairness to the Korean martial science I must report that the Koreans did not need to be instructed by the Japanese on how to acquit themselves with a sword, bow, horse, or spear. It is quite easy to be swayed by the patrilinear system introduced by the Japanese to Korea in that it was brought and maintained in no small measure by returning ex-pats after the war and lends itself handsomely to commerce which the older Korean educational system did not. FWIW.

Best Wishes,

Bruce

[Brian Owens]

Originally posted by Shimura
See if you can get a number of the legitimate NBTHK in Tokyo. I had one in one of my sword books, and as soon as I find it I'll post here for you. I know that they were working in conjuction with the US Military at the end of the war in returning some blades to their families.
Nippon Bijutsu Token Hozon Kyokai
4-25-10 Yoyogi
Shibuya-ku
Tokyo 151
Japan