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hectokan
6th December 2003, 08:09
So are the older ways really better?

Finny
6th December 2003, 09:23
aarrrgghhh!!!! It Burns!! IT BUUHHUUURRRRNNSSS!!!!!!!!

Iain
6th December 2003, 09:55
Try putting it in butter...

Finny
6th December 2003, 10:44
mmmm.... Lardy.

hehehe reminded me of the Seinfeld episode where Kramer starts using butter to shave with.

don
6th December 2003, 19:45
Originally posted by hectokan
So are the older ways really better?

Of course.

Look how depraved we have become in our political and spiritual lives. We hold to technology rather than the heart. Oh, for the days of simple wisdom and virile lifestyles of the likes of Yamamoto Tsunetomo who had these sage words of advice for us suffering the slings and arrows of modern life made corrupt: "...drinking a decoction of the feces from a dappled horse is the way to stop bleeding from an injury received by falling off a horse." (Hagakure, Trans. Wm. Scott Wilson, Kodansha, Tokyo, 1979, p. 67.)

Julian Gerhart
7th December 2003, 04:00
Originally posted by don
Of course.

Look how depraved we have become in our political and spiritual lives. We hold to technology rather than the heart. Oh, for the days of simple wisdom and virile lifestyles of the likes of Yamamoto Tsunetomo who had these sage words of advice for us suffering the slings and arrows of modern life made corrupt: "...drinking a decoction of the feces from a dappled horse is the way to stop bleeding from an injury received by falling off a horse." (Hagakure, Trans. Wm. Scott Wilson, Kodansha, Tokyo, 1979, p. 67.)
tried it, didn't work.

Daniel san
7th December 2003, 17:34
Originally posted by don
Of course.

Look how depraved we have become in our political and spiritual lives. We hold to technology rather than the heart. Oh, for the days of simple wisdom and virile lifestyles of the likes of Yamamoto Tsunetomo who had these sage words of advice for us suffering the slings and arrows of modern life made corrupt: "...drinking a decoction of the feces from a dappled horse is the way to stop bleeding from an injury received by falling off a horse." (Hagakure, Trans. Wm. Scott Wilson, Kodansha, Tokyo, 1979, p. 67.)

This is just about a perfect summary of the movie. Good heavens, it was bad.

Kinteki
7th December 2003, 19:31
On the up side, there was some pretty cool Armor, weapons, and scenery............I just wish they hadnt consulted Ashida Kim for information on the ninja ;)
Crossbows and Stephen K Hayes swords.....

don
7th December 2003, 20:29
Originally posted by Kinteki
On the up side, ..

...was some good acting, exciting action, and real pathos. I enjoyed it a lot.

Bustillo, A.
8th December 2003, 16:25
Originally posted by don
...was some good acting, exciting action, and real pathos. I enjoyed it a lot.

Indeed.

And great cinematography.

David T Anderson
8th December 2003, 17:38
Originally posted by Bustillo, A.
Indeed.

And great cinematography.

Hmmm...Did anybody else find this movie really dark, esp. in the first half? Even the sunlit scenes seemed muted and underlit....or maybe it was just the theatre I was in...

Shimura
8th December 2003, 18:32
Yeah, it did seem to have a dark, etheral quality about it. Perhaps to add to the feeling of this being the end of an era, and of course to add mystery and awe with the samurai rebels charging out of the darkness/mist. Overall I was actually surprised by the movie. I first thought it would have been just another Tom Cruise vehicle, but alas it had some good things and did alright in portraying the spirit of budo. The ninja scenes were a little over the top, and not very "stealthy", but I actually liked some of the swordplay between Cruise and his Japanese peers. I kind of enjoyed watching Tom getting the snot beat out of him. Of course had it been real, he would have been left with quite a few broken bones.

The best actor though was definitely Ken Watanabe. Awsome, his expressions and everything reeked samurai and I think he out acted Tom by far. I'll have to admit he's probably my favorite Japanese actor, after Mifune. I'll have to try and watch some of his other films.

don
8th December 2003, 20:37
Originally posted by Shimura
The best actor though was definitely Ken Watanabe....probably my favorite Japanese actor, after Mifune.

Yes, I enjoyed his performance, too (as well as Bob's).

Ujio, the character who beat up Cruise, was played by a fellow named Sanada Hiroyuki. He starred in a beautiful movie called Sharaku some years ago about the Ukiyo-e artist of the same name. He has a natural athleticism that the director made good use of in the film. I doubt that you can find it here, but I recommend it if you can.

Daniel san
9th December 2003, 17:16
Hello,
I have two beautiful hands that work properly and, at times, adeptly. On these two hands are ten wonderful fingers. They do almost everything I ask of them without complaint. The minor complaints I do get come when I have asked unreasonable things of them. The only problem is this one rather nasty wart on the end of my right forefinger. Everyone sees this thing (being on my dominant hand) and judges not only the digits on that hand, but also the entire other hand. It didn't do anything wrong, it was just there, until the interloper came. Even the wart didn't do anything wrong exactly, it is just being itself. Granted, it's a contagious genital wart that has the potential of infecting everything it touches.
MMMmmmetaphor

Brian Owens
10th December 2003, 08:17
Originally posted by Daniel san
This is just about a perfect summary of the movie. Good heavens, it was bad.
Did they show a different Last Samurai in Texas than they did in Seattle?

I thought it was one of the best movies in years, and the majority of the audiences here, from comments and reviews, seem to agree.

Gene Gabel
10th December 2003, 09:14
Originally posted by Yagyu Kenshi
Did they show a different Last Samurai in Texas than they did in Seattle?

I thought it was one of the best movies in years, and the majority of the audiences here, from comments and reviews, seem to agree.
..................................

I liked it also. Sets,armor, et all... My only problems was with the sword throwing and the grating sound every batto made (probably post production) and they way they slammed back into the saya on noto.
I think over all they did a fine job

BTW check out the History Channel Saturday for the historical validity of it all..

Gene Gabel

Tristan
11th December 2003, 09:36
~~
The movie was very good, IMO. As with any movie, there are going to be discrepencies as far as historical and technical thouroughness. You just have to realize it's not made to be a history lesson or an instruction manual on Kenjustsu (or whatever else sword art).
~~

Kimpatsu
18th December 2003, 04:05
I saw the movie last weekend and thoroughly enjoyed it. Cruise, however, was outclassed by Ken Watanabe as Katsumoto. What say you all?

samuraix
18th December 2003, 04:30
I realy liked the movie(despite the ninjas:D )

Brian Owens
18th December 2003, 07:26
Originally posted by Kimpatsu
Cruise, however, was outclassed by Ken Watanabe as Katsumoto. What say you all? Absolutely. Tom Cruise may have been the "star" but Watanabe can act! Especially when you consider that English is his second language.

A powerful and moving performance. As I mentioned earlier (possibly in a different thread. I didn't scroll up to check) many in the audience during the Sneak Preview I attended were teary eyed and choked up during one important scene (I won't give away the storyline, for those who haven't seen it). You don't get that kind of reaction unless the audience has made a personal connection with the character.

If Watanabe doesn't get an Academy Award nomination I say we storm the AMPAS Headquarters and face down the LAPD with all their guns and APCs, armed only with our swords and our bows, and go out in a blaze of glory!

Oh...heh heh. Got a little carried away. So sorry. :nw:

Tristan
18th December 2003, 14:25
Originally posted by Kimpatsu
I saw the movie last weekend and thoroughly enjoyed it. Cruise, however, was outclassed by Ken Watanabe as Katsumoto. What say you all?

~~
100% agreement from over here.:)
~~

Shimura
19th December 2003, 13:44
I may have said it before, but Watanabe is THE next Mifune, and in some respects better.:D

Chrono
21st December 2003, 17:49
I just saw it yesterday and I must say I thought it was pretty dang good. One question though, and I hope I'm not alone on this: Did any one else shed any tears during the end when Katsumoto committed seppuku?

Jon

John Lindsey
21st December 2003, 18:01
Not really, I didn’t feel much of an emotional attachment to the film, like I did with Saving Private Ryan, The Pianist, Schindler’s List, Glory, etc.

At one time during the big battle, I thought how sad it was to see Japanese killing fellow Japanese in a civil war, and then I realized that they have been doing throughout their history!

Walking out of the theater, I mused about how Tom Cruise’s character could be blamed for Pearl Harbor, since he was the one who insisted that the emperor not forget the old ways….

don
21st December 2003, 18:53
Originally posted by Chrono
Did any one else shed any tears during the end when Katsumoto committed seppuku?

No.

But Saigo (Katsumoto), resented losing the perquisites of power--pork for a class which had essentially been parasitical on the backs of the productive elements they held in contempt for two and half centuries--and preferred death to that fate. His choice.

I liked Watanabe Ken and the movie, though.

samuraix
21st December 2003, 19:14
no I didn't shed any tears, but it was sad watching all the samurai die(like when the guy who would never talk but he would folow tom around hopped in front of someone about to stab tom, made me sad)but then when I started to think about how they where dieing for there beliefs, I did not realy feel that sad...

Brian Owens
21st December 2003, 22:02
Originally posted by Chrono
...I hope I'm not alone on this: Did any one else shed any tears during the end when Katsumoto committed seppuku?Maybe we Seattleites are just a bunch of maudlin morons, but both times I've seen it, many in the audience, men and women, were brought to tears.

I shed a few, myself, during the final battle, as the brave samurai were being cut down by the Gattling guns.

don
21st December 2003, 22:11
Originally posted by Yagyu Kenshi
I shed a few, myself, during the final battle, as the brave samurai were being cut down by the Gattling guns.

Oh!

God!

Yes!

And how about after Jim Brown threw the grenades into the ballroom and was running for the truck?

:p

Chrono
22nd December 2003, 03:15
Originally posted by Yagyu Kenshi
I shed a few, myself, during the final battle, as the brave samurai were being cut down by the Gattling guns.

That's when I started feeling the lump in my throat. Right after the seppuku I felt a tear roll down my cheek.

Jon

Brian Owens
22nd December 2003, 09:52
Originally posted by Chrono
That's when I started feeling the lump in my throat. Right after the seppuku I felt a tear roll down my cheek.
The only other movie in recent memory (well, recent for an old guy -- 1986) that affected me as deeply was The Mission.

I also wept openly and unashamed in the scene where Father Gabriel (Jeremy Irons) was leading the villagers, "armed" only with the Cross from the mission's alter, as they were being cut down by the Portugese soldiers.

I guess I just have a soft spot for courage and moral conviction in the face of insurmountable odds.

don
22nd December 2003, 20:43
Originally posted by Yagyu Kenshi
The only other movie in recent memory (well, recent for an old guy -- 1986) that affected me as deeply was The Mission.

Schindler's List for me. That last scene where Liam Keeley is walking to his car and he breaks down when he realizes its value could have been denominated in human lives. Phew!

Cady Goldfield
22nd December 2003, 21:31
I cried like a freakin' baby when the last stalwart band of Samurai got mowed down by the Gattling gun. Especially when the young Japanese army lieutenant started crying as he watched the massacre. The moment was just too laden with meaning. You know -- technology and minimal training vs. age-old skills and lifetime discipline; the end of a "noble" way of life; brave dudes with no hope of survival doing the "Thermopoli" than.

Okay, so it was maudlin. It was hyperbole. It was... Hollywood.

I still bawled like a moron at that short scene.

The rest of the movie didn't give me any emotional rushes, though. The scene where Katsumoto's son is shot (multiple times, complete with big blood spurts) on the bridge, and is "dying," with blood hemoraghing out of his mouth and nose, and his father is giving him the tragic, soulful farewell. Then the kid gets up and strides onto the bridge (moments ago, his liver was practically lying in his lap) and finds that fruitful second wind. Yah. Right. I loved it. But it was too corny for tears.

Tony,
I agree that Watanabe way outclasses Cruise. The movie would have been fine without Tom, except as an excuse to have "Bob" around. :D
Watanabe is a fine actor, while Cruise is still playing himself in various settings and getups. A lot of newspaper critics noted that at least he's getting better at playing himself, but he's still a one-note melody. Watanabe has much more depth and range. I liked the contrast between warrior mode and his participation in the village theatrical performance.

Don,
Shindler's List is a different league from "Samurai," IMO. I can't compare the two modes, since Shindler's List was an unadorned, true story -- in fact, toned down a lot so as not to totally overwhelm and devastate the audience. "Samurai" just isn't in that league or capable of stirring the same range of emotions - or depth of despair -as a story of out-and-out hatred and genocide.

Kimpatsu
22nd December 2003, 23:14
Hi, Cady.
You've nailed my point exactly; Cruise, like Keanu Reeves, only ever plays himself. One note repeated often does not a melody make. Watanabe really had some meat to his role.
Merry Xmas/Yule/Hannukah.

Steven Resell
23rd December 2003, 00:38
All in all I give it thumbs up. I go to the movies to be entertained and definitely was. The film did not seem as long as the two and a half hours it actually was (that's always a good sign).

BTW, I also have to give the thumbs up for Ken Watanabe.
I also really liked Hiroyuki Sanada (Harry Sanada), the guy teaching Tom a "lesson" with a bokuto. Not much of a speaking part but I liked the "look". FWIW, I liked him in "Ringu" and he was apparently pretty good in "Twilight Samurai" (on my list to see).

jeffbruner
23rd December 2003, 00:49
Originally posted by Cady Goldfield
Okay, so it was maudlin. It was hyperbole. It was... Hollywood.


Well, I just saw it last night. I couldn't get past the dilettante-ism. It was soooooo Hollywood. Blech. What a disappointment.

Ultimately it was saddening to have what I have spent the last 30 years studying and applying to my life put on the screen by Hollywood producers who have only a romanticised surface knowlege of bushido. It was just so empty.

Interestingly it was analagous to Katsumoto's own plight to convince the emperor of the necessity of maintaining a link with tradition and acknowleging the samurai lineage.

Katsumoto's words fell on deaf ears. Just as the producers were deaf to the true essence of bushido.

I guess I was expecting way too much. I was expecting Kurasowa. But that wouldn't be Hollywood......

Just a judoka.

koma
23rd December 2003, 03:41
When I go to a movie, I go to see a movie. I don't try to analize it at the time. I don't try to fit it in to some catagory as to whether it's correctly done or not. I go to be entertained. And entertained I was. Even though Tom Cruise was in it. I won't say I loved it. But I'll probably buy it when released on DVD.
Now for the analysis...
Watanabe made the film. No doubt. He acted circles around Cruise.Even the silent samurai acted circles around Cruise. As for the ninja, the producers just gave the viewers what the viewers have come to expect from cinema ninja.

Chrono
23rd December 2003, 03:53
Originally posted by Cady Goldfield

I agree that Watanabe way outclasses Cruise. The movie would have been fine without Tom, except as an excuse to have "Bob" around. :D
Watanabe is a fine actor, while Cruise is still playing himself in various settings and getups. A lot of newspaper critics noted that at least he's getting better at playing himself, but he's still a one-note melody. Watanabe has much more depth and range. I liked the contrast between warrior mode and his participation in the village theatrical performance.


How true this is. I thought he was a fine actor, perhaps, and some of you might even agree, he's a better actor than Tom. Is this the first film Wantanabe has been in, or has he been in other, non-American films I've never heard of yet?

Jon

Kimpatsu
23rd December 2003, 03:58
Originally posted by Chrono
How true this is. I thought he was a fine actor, perhaps, and some of you might even agree, he's a better actor than Tom. Is this the first film Wantanabe has been in, or has he been in other, non-American films I've never heard of yet?
Ken Watanabe is an old hand at acting; he's been in dozens of films in Japan. He also had a bout of leukemia, but seems to have made a full recovery. Certainly, he showed no signs of the illness in the Last Samurai, which after all was a strenuous role.
HTH.

Brian Owens
23rd December 2003, 04:06
Originally posted by Chrono
Is this the first film Wantanabe has been in, or has he been in other, non-American films I've never heard of yet?

The Last Samurai and Tampopo are the only films he's been in that I have seen, but I know he is a well known actor in Japan.

Here is a list of his roles, from the Internet Movie Database:

Last Samurai, The (2003) .... Katsumoto

T.R.Y. (2003) .... Masanobu Azuma

Hi wa mata noboru (2002) .... Okubo

Sennen no koi - hikaru genji monogatari (2002) .... Fujiwara Michinaga/Fujiwara Nobutaka
... aka Genji: A Thousand-Year Love (2002)

"Hojo Tokimune" (2001) TV Series

"Ikebukuro West Gate park" (2000) TV Series

Supeesu toraberaazu (2000) .... Sakamaki ("Crusher")
... aka Space Travelers (2000)

Oboreru sakana (2000) .... Miyota

Kizuna (1998) .... Police Detective Sako

Rajio no jikan (1997) .... Truck Driver
... aka Radio no jikan (1997)
... aka Welcome Back, Mr. McDonald (1997)

Kimitachi ga ite boku ga iru (1992) (TV)

Bakumatsu jyunjyoden (1991) .... Ryouma Sakamoto

Umi to dokuyaku (1986) .... Toda
... aka Sea and Poison, The (1987) (USA)

Tampopo (1985) .... Gun
... aka Dandelion (1985)

Kekkon annai mystery (1985) .... Funayama Tetsuya/Masakazu Sekine

Setouchi shonen yakyu dan (1984) .... Tetsuo
... aka MacArthur's Children (1984)

Also, a brief bio:


Both of Ken's parents were teachers. His mother taught general education and his dad taught calligraphy. He became interested in acting at the age of 24 when a director of England's National Theatre Company told him that acting was his special gift, when he studied there.

Ken is mostly known in Japan for playing Samurai. He incorporates the Samurai's values in his daily life by not amassing to many material possessions and by living his life with honor, pride and discipline. "The Last Samurai" is his fourth film and he has also starred in roles as a gangster, a businessmen and a general.

Ken is currently separated from his wife and has two children, an 18 year old daughter who is working as a model and one son who is 20 years old.
I don't know why the bio says it's only his fourth film.

Chrono
23rd December 2003, 04:24
Thanks Brian, I was just about to look for his filmography. Perhaps I should checkout a few of those films.

Jon

Steven Resell
23rd December 2003, 16:28
Mr. Wood,

Although not a "samurai flick", I really recommend Tampopo with Ken Watanabe. He plays a supporting role but a good one nontheless.

Steven

Chrono
24th December 2003, 03:07
Originally posted by Steven Resell
Mr. Wood,

Although not a "samurai flick", I really recommend Tampopo with Ken Watanabe. He plays a supporting role but a good one nontheless.

Steven

Thanks for the recommendation Steven. By the way, where's the best place to go to get Japanese movies?

Jon

Kimpatsu
24th December 2003, 03:19
Originally posted by Chrono
By the way, where's the best place to go to get Japanese movies?

Japan? ;)
Seriously, though, try Amazon (www.amazon.com) for NTSC videos.

Brian Owens
24th December 2003, 03:25
Originally posted by Chrono
By the way, where's the best place to go to get Japanese movies?If you want to buy them, Amazon.com has a large selection.

If you want to rent, it depends on where you live. Here in Seattle, with our large Japanese population, it's no problem. I couldn't say about where you live. Check the usual sources like Blockbuster and Hollywood Video for the more popular titles. Some will be dubbed in English, others will have subtitles.

Chrono
24th December 2003, 03:47
Originally posted by Yagyu Kenshi
Check the usual sources like Blockbuster and Hollywood Video for the more popular titles. Some will be dubbed in English, others will have subtitles.

We have a Movie Gallery, but I've already searched them. They don't have a very good selection of general martial arts movies, let alone Japanese ones. I guess I'll have to get them from Amazon.

Jon

Brian Owens
24th December 2003, 04:45
Originally posted by Chrono
I guess I'll have to get them from Amazon.
If you're going to have to buy them, let me tell you what I did a few years back:

To save money I got together with some friends who were also martial arts movie fans, and each of us would buy one film which we would then share. Sort of a movie-of-the-month thing.

Sometimes we'd get together at someone's house to watch as a group (good for those that didn't have VCRs -- not ubiquitous back then), other times we'd pass them around.

I got to see more movies than I would have if I'd had to buy them all myself, plus I had someone to talk about them with.

Just a thought, for what it's worth.

Steven Resell
24th December 2003, 16:15
Mr. Wood,

Recently I've been getting a lot of my Japanese films at the local Border's and Tower Records. I couldn't believe it when I saw the entire Zatoichi series on DVDs at Border's!!!

FWIW, a buddy of mine rents a lot of foreign films off of "Netflix". I haven't seen their selection so I'm not sure if they carry "tampopo" in particular, but it seems as though he has rented several chanbara type movies from there.

Steven

Chrono
24th December 2003, 22:32
Originally posted by Steven Resell
Mr. Wood,

Recently I've been getting a lot of my Japanese films at the local Border's and Tower Records. I couldn't believe it when I saw the entire Zatoichi series on DVDs at Border's!!!

FWIW, a buddy of mine rents a lot of foreign films off of "Netflix". I haven't seen their selection so I'm not sure if they carry "tampopo" in particular, but it seems as though he has rented several chanbara type movies from there.

Steven

Border's? I love Border's! I get all my books from there. I'll have to make sure and look next time.

I remember watching a small interview with, I think, the founder of Netflix and he said that they have every single DVD that has been made. But, I'm not sure if he meant throughout the world, or just the US.

Jon

Julian Gerhart
24th December 2003, 23:22
Originally posted by Yagyu Kenshi


If you want to rent, it depends on where you live. Here in Seattle, with our large Japanese population, it's no problem. I couldn't say about where you live. Check the usual sources like Blockbuster and Hollywood Video for the more popular titles. Some will be dubbed in English, others will have subtitles.
You really live in seattle Brian? scarecrow video, the largest video store there is, is the best place to go when searching for any obscure film. be it foriegn or otherwise. If scarecrow doesn't have it you probably have to go to japan to get it.

Brian Owens
25th December 2003, 06:40
Originally posted by Julian Gerhart
You really live in seattle Brian? scarecrow video, the largest video store there is, is the best place to go when searching for any obscure film...
I know; that's why I said "Here in Seattle...it's no problem." Scarecrow caters to just about every ethnic/socio-economic/political/whatever group there is. Whenever I get to the University District I head for Scarecrow just to spend an hour or so browsing.

I only said "Check the usual sources like Blockbuster and Hollywood Video for the more popular titles" because they're all over the country and Chrono isn't in Seattle.

I, on the other hand, have been in Seattle practically since the Meaker girls first arrived. :D

I also go to Kinokunia at Uwajimaya, though more for books than movies. (My job takes me to the ID several times a week, so it's not an extra trip.)

Brian "the web footed" Owens

Brian Owens
25th December 2003, 07:02
Edit to above post: Don't tell me, all you Seattleites, I know. I feel like a fool. First I wrote "Meeker Girls" and that didn't look right, so I changed it to "Meaker Girls" and it still didn't look right. Then I realized it should have been "Mercer Girls" but my time to edit was up.

I really do pride myself on my knowledge of Seattle history, but sometimes my typing goes faster than my brain can follow.

Troy McClure
26th December 2003, 17:38
Another good resource is Netflix (http://www.netflix.com/). I haven't looked too in depth at their Japanese movie selection, but a friend of mine says their Asian movie section is huge. He's big into movies from Hong Kong and finds many that otherwise would be unavailable here in Texas.

Daniel san
27th December 2003, 22:43
Hello,
Thanks for the info on netflix I had never heard of them. Is your name really Troy Mcclure? Like on the Simpsons? That must be tough, sorry.

tanoshiidesu
6th January 2004, 21:43
Seeing the Last Samurai was entertaining, but I wouldn't describe it as being more than that. It was an eastern western and as I watched there were some parts that really bothered me and my friends who were with me. The emperor was a huge disappointment, he was very foppish which I thought was an unneccesary twist to his already weak character, further more I don't believe that Japan was founded "by a handful of honourable men". I think it was more than that and it wasn't all honour and glory. I have a few more issues with the movie, but aside from the problems the film was very entertainment but that's all. Akira Kurasowa films are better if one is interested in samurai movies, but this was more of a western in my opinion. And if one wants to go looking for good movies at good prices...a ton can be found on ebay.
shitsurei shimasu,
Shelley

Earl Hartman
8th January 2004, 00:14
I saw it. It wasn't quite as bad as I thought it would be.

Shrug.

Can't hold a candle to a really good period piece made by a good Japanese director. I imagine the effect would be similar if we here in the West watched a film about, say, Robin Hood directed by a Japanese director.

As my wife said, for a film about Japan made by an American, it wasn't that bad.

But, come on: having the cherry blossoms scattering to the wind as Katsumoto is dying? Gimme a break.

However, I thought the repsects paid by the soldiers to the samurai was a nice touch.

However, for the film to work, you have to accept the premise that the samurai were brave and honorable men, as opposed to a rapacious and parasitic self-appointed armed nobility who took power by armed force and then proceeded to oppress the other 90% of the country under the threat of being killed out of hand. You aslo have to accept that modernity with all of those disgusting things like trechnological, scientific, and medical advances and democracy was actually a regression. Nonsense, of course.

Anyway, I'm not going to bother to watch it again, but I have seen worse. The production values were pretty good, and the kyujutsu wasn't half bad, so all in all it wasn't a total waste of time. But Cruise still can't act.

FWIW, I have heard that the Emperor Meiji actually was a fairly slight and aristocratic man.

Joseph Svinth
8th January 2004, 03:06
Brian --

Whew. For a minute there, I thought you were going to tell me you were from Sumner or Puyallup. (For those who are wondering what I am talking about, see http://www.lib.washington.edu/specialcoll/findaids/docs/photosgraphics/MeekerEzraPHColl596.xml .)

As for what Brian is talking about, see http://www.historylink.org/output.cfm?file_id=1125 and http://www.seattleschools.org/area/archives/history.xml

Or, if you're of the right age, think of David Soul as you sing along with Perry Como.

Brian Owens
8th January 2004, 08:17
Originally posted by Joseph Svinth
Or, if you're of the right age, think of David Soul as you sing along with Perry Como.
I always think of Bobby Sherman. I will always equate David Soul with Starsky & Hutch.

And obviously Perry Como was only here in July, August, or September. "The bluest skies you've ever seen are in Seattle"? Should have been "The greyest skies..." ;)

I've been iced in up in the Silver Lake area for the last 2 days. Finally got out this evening. How's it been down in Edmonds?

hyaku
8th January 2004, 16:09
Well, better late than never, I have a copy! I liked the storyline and the movie apart from the baseball sword techniques that predominate done by both Western and Japanese.

As usual a Tateshi cant turn actors into swordsmen within a few days so we cant really expect too much can we.

I saw Kill Bill too and begged my friend not to even get me copy of that. The only realistic bit in it was the Japanese girl band.

Hyakutake Colin

Rennis
8th January 2004, 18:08
Originally posted by Earl Hartman

FWIW, I have heard that the Emperor Meiji actually was a fairly slight and aristocratic man.

He may have been in his younger days, but towards the end of his life he had actually become a fairly large man who was well known in circles who would be in the know to have eating and drinking problems (which the court of course tried their best to cover up). If I remember correctly Bix mentioned this in his biography on Hirohito.

Rennis Buchner

Brian Owens
9th January 2004, 06:33
Originally posted by hyaku
Well, better late than never, I have a copy!
You mean it's already out on video in Japan?

Is the English dialog subtitled in Japanese or was it shown there just as it weas here?

hyaku
9th January 2004, 15:31
Originally posted by Yagyu Kenshi
You mean it's already out on video in Japan?

Is the English dialog subtitled in Japanese or was it shown there just as it weas here?

No I get my stuff In South East Asia. Got Lord of the Rings DVD a week before it was released.

Hyakutake Colin

Kimpatsu
9th January 2004, 16:28
Originally posted by Yagyu Kenshi
You mean it's already out on video in Japan?
No; the movie's still at the cinemas here. Must be a pirate version.

Originally posted by Yagyu Kenshi
Is the English dialog subtitled in Japanese or was it shown there just as it weas here?
Where I saw it in Shinjuku, all the Japanese was subtitled in English, and all the English was subtitled in Japanese. Pretty universal, really.

Mushin San
17th January 2004, 00:10
I was not tearful when Katsumoto was able to die with honor and his morals intact. I was happy that when push became shove he did what bushido dictated. I just wish Tom Cruise was not in the movie. The first time he approached the emperor he enterted the mats with his right foot:rolleyes: I found it sickening that Cruise was able to influence the emperor when katsumoto found deaf ears. I can not forget round eye conguers are always right and know more:rolleyes:

Elf Tengu
17th January 2004, 17:52
Yes, Watanabe and Sanada superb, Cruise playing Cruise, complete with foppish hair as in 99% of his other fillums, a shame, but worst of all, Cruise surviving after bullets being shown blasting out of his back, highhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhly unlikely!

Everybody should have died, or they could have saved Katsumoto's son for the end scene with Emperor Meiji.

By the way, what ninjas?

All I saw was a bunch of black dudes (well, they didn't look Japanese with their make-up on) in leather with very modern 'Barnett Phantom' looking crossbows. I find it unlikely, but will bow to superior knowledge, that ninja used face paint. Perhaps the bad guys beamed a Delta Force team in from the future. Fantastic fight scene the ninja one though, probably the best of the whole film.

Why oh why didn't Tom Cruise die? And why did he have to go off to the village at the end?
As if the whole village would be pleased to see the gaijin return when all their menfolk had perished!

Actually, next to Watanabe, I thought the kids were the next best actors in the film.

And has anyone noticed the stereotypical blonde curly-locked moustachio'd U.S. Cavalry bad guy that keeps turning up in every period piece action flick, from Shanghai Noon to God knows what! I know there's been one in several recent movies, can anyone add to the list? Was there one in the patriot? Or Wild Wild west?

Chrono
17th January 2004, 18:05
Originally posted by Elf Tengu
Why oh why didn't Tom Cruise die? And why did he have to go off to the village at the end?
As if the whole village would be pleased to see the gaijin return when all their menfolk had perished!

I was wondering the same thing when I saw it. Plus, I don't think it made much sense after he told Watanabe about the Greek war, though I forgot who it was.

Jon