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Stany
18th February 2004, 17:55
What kind of meditation do the samurais practice?
thx
Stany

Joel Simmons
24th February 2004, 21:43
Aloha,

Well...that really depends on which sect of Buddhism with which they were associated. Different sects of Buddhism put different emphasis on certain types of meditation or other rituals.

Early in the history of the Samurai class, they gravitated towards Shingon Buddhism as it proclaimed "here-and-now" benefits through esoteric practices. Later on, during the Edo-period when many Samurai were not actively battling amongst themselves, is when Zen started to take more of a foothold. Instead of instantaneous battlefield results like those promised via Shingon, Zen was to begin a refinement of many ryu.

You also have to take into account the geographical locale of particular groups. In Kyushu, many Samurai were not Buddhist at all. Many were Christian.

poonagan
3rd March 2004, 20:07
The sensei where I last trained is a member of the osho cult and brings the osho meditations into the dojo. I'm sure she thinks its a great thing. But I'm not. Anyone know anything about this form?

kokumo
3rd March 2004, 20:29
Originally posted by poonagan
The sensei where I last trained is a member of the osho cult and brings the osho meditations into the dojo. I'm sure she thinks its a great thing. But I'm not. Anyone know anything about this form?

poonagan:

There are many forms of meditation and Osho was particularly eclectic.

My personal view is that the problems associated with Osho had more to do with Osho and some members of his inner circle than they did with the meditative techniques he borrowed from more orthodox Hindu and Buddhist traditions, just as the problems associated with some Christian televangelists have more to do with those individuals than with the fairly common Christian practice of daily devotional prayer.

Then there is the question why this is a concern for you, given that you apparently no longer train at that dojo.

For future reference, you should also be aware all e-budo posters agree to sign their posts with their actual names at the time they sign up.

Hope this helps,

Fred Little

not-I
9th March 2004, 07:25
Originally posted by hawaiianvw67
Aloha,


Early in the history of the Samurai class, they gravitated towards Shingon Buddhism as it proclaimed "here-and-now" benefits through esoteric practices. Later on, during the Edo-period when many Samurai were not actively battling amongst themselves, is when Zen started to take more of a foothold. Instead of instantaneous battlefield results like those promised via Shingon, Zen was to begin a refinement of many ryu.


Actually, although Shingon stressed "here-and-now" benefits, Zen meditation was (and is) geared toward living in the here-and-now, not by using mantras and "magical" practices, but by "seeing things as they really are". Zen Buddhism was especially popular among the samurai, becasue it showed the distinction between life and death to be empty. Traditionally, it was said that the Emperor and his family practiced Tendai, the aristocrats Shingon, the samurai Zen, and the peasants Jodo (Pure Land). There is indeed a very strong connection between the samurai and Zen Buddhism, with Rinzai Zen monks like Hakuin and Takuan writing specifically to samurai. Winston King's Zen & The Way of the Sword outlines this relationship.

As to Christianity, yes it was accepted by some daimyo, mainly (we may suppose) to secure firearms from the Portugese, and many common people as well as samurai accepted it, especially with the encouragement of Spanish and Portugese missionaries.

However, Japan had and still has a very ecclectic religious culture, which picks and chooses from a rich heritage of Shinto, Buddhist, and Christian practices.

kenkyusha
9th March 2004, 18:42
Zen did not take hold as a popular method of practice until the end of the Segoku Jidai (as outlined above), partly because there was no element of ritual. Chanting mantra, making gestures and carrying tokens for luck figure heavily into many 'warrior' traditions, in and out of Japan. Until recently in Java, people routinely carried or were tattooed with anting-anting for luck in life, but particularly battle. May seem superstitious, but given the circumstances, any leg-up when you need it, ne?

Citing Takuan (the bulk of whose work took place after the battle of Sekigahara), or anyone else as proof of a long-emeshed relationship w/the bushi seems a bit suspect.

Be well,
Jigme

not-I
9th March 2004, 21:30
Hi Jigme and thanks for your reply.

While I agree that my citation of Takuan could seem historically misleading, it was not meant as "proof" of anything, only as an example of a strong later relationship. I wished to write a consise reply and not to provide a history of Zen-ryu -- mea culpa. However, conducting an historical discussion without citing "anyone else" would be more than a bit suspect, non? King's book, while not terribly original, is a decent synopsis written by a reputable historian, which I partly paraphrase below. To wit:

Zen was introduced to Japan by Eisai (1141-1215), a Tendai monk, and embraced by the fourth Hojo regent, Hojo Tokiyori (1227-1263), who personally practiced Zen, promoted it among the aristoracy, and patronised the building of temples. This was carried on by the Ashikaga shoguns (1333-1573). By about 1300, Zen had grown into a nationwide establishment. The Five Mountain (gozan) system of Zen temple ranking was founded around this time. And with Ashikaga Takauji, Zen priests became leading advisors to the shogunate. "And not only did the Zen sect prosper in terms of favor of high officials, but also among the rank-and-file samurai themselves. It seems that from the beginning of Zen's 'new' presence, its meditation and discipline commended themselves to the samurai, of both high and low rank." (W.L. King, Zen & the Way of the Sword, Oxford University Press, 1993: 29-30) And all this, please note, long before the Sengoku-jidai, which is usally dated from 1467 (Onin War) to 1568. Granted, Zen did not become popular among "common people" until the end of this period, but they are not the subject of this thread.

Also, the claim that Zen lacked/lacks ritual is false. Zen, being a branch of Mahayana Buddhism, always included many, albeit stripped-down, rituals such as sutra-chanting and involved ceremonies for "refuge taking," Buddhist holidays, funerals, etc. The Soto branch of Zen also included "esoteric" practices, like the transmission of kirigami (secret initiation documents). But if you are referring to more "superstitious" practices like carrying talismen, using special hand-gestures to ward off evil, etc., then yes, Zen always had, at least in principle, little use for these.

My claim, based on extensive reading, is not that Zen had a monopoly on the Bushi's loyalties -- the Japanese were always religiously ecclectic, and a warrior might meditate at a Zen temple at home, but chant "namu amida butsu" (a Jodo-shu practice) or trust in a Shinto talisman on the battlefield -- it is that Zen was their "unofficial-official religion" from a relatively early time (the mid to late 13th century).

I hope this clears up any of your suspicions regarding my first post.

Greetings!

nimbus
21st March 2004, 09:20
could you be more precise on the type of Osho meditation you're speaking of? There're many different ones.

shieldcaster
16th October 2004, 03:26
Anyone got any references for these 'Christian' samurai? I'd be very interested in reading more.

Thanks.