Are you train a jo every day?

[szczepan]

That was a question Kawahara sensei asked us last weekend semninar in Toronto....

any comments?

regardz

[Ron Tisdale]

Hi Szczepan (spelled it right for once),

I don't make every day, but I've been trying to make sure every time I hit the mat, I also practise a jo kata, at least once slow, and once fast. I've been working on a kata one of my instructors taught at a seminar which I find facinating, and envigorating. Working on this kata has really improved my jo work, and I believe my empty handed technique as well.

I don't know how orthodox this is, but a friend of mine recently made me an iron (steel) jo. It weighs about 20 pounds, and I'm building up to using it for the kata. I don't use it at the dojo, just at home. I'm not sure its appropriate for a jo (there's a different feel and "spirit" in the steel from the wood), but I think its ok just for training. It is increasing my strength quite a bit already (its only been a month or so that I've had it). It's also improving my balance. I'll let you know how it goes (positive and negative). I do hope to start doing basic movements (empty hand) and jo/boken work every day soon.

Ron Tisdale

[Sochin]

The only danger I know of using such a heavy jo is the strain on the joints from trying to manage the momentum. If you keep it slow enought the momentum is kept to a minimum, you'll get good value for your effort.

An aside: bagua zhang trains bo and jo made of heavy metal bars, I mean really heavy ! This is so that you just can't manage with arm strength alone and must utilize the center core of the body to get movement and to control momentum. Also, if your enemy gets your jo or sword he won't be able to use it aginst you!

Remember, a thousand cuts a day keeps the sensei away! :D

[Neil Yamamoto]

I have been using a stainless steel jo for years. Mine is about 15lbs, if they had cut it the length I wanted, it would have been about the same as Ron's. Here is how I approach the use of it.

Building correct technique.
By moving slowly in kata, you can feel where you are moving from and how well you are balanced. If you are not doing it correctly, you will get tired fast and constantly feel off balanced.

Conditioning
Again, slower movements to help build strength. Repetition of cuts in a happo giri type of thing work wonders for this.

Punishment
I mean, encouraging students. One hundred cuts makes most students learn to pay attention.

Don Angier has re-bar duct taped together, it was a great learning experience using that some years ago.

[Ron Tisdale]

Hey, thanks for the support guys. I aggree about the slower is better....If I start hearing the bones in my wrist go "pop", I slow down.... :)

I thought about using rebar, but it has too much flex in it generaly, even the thicker ones, and I like the smooth feel from the steel (pardon the rhyme). Even taped, the rebar just doesn't feel right to me. I'm really glad my friend could get this for me...like I said, the differnce is noticable.

Quick question...Neil-san, do you oil yours at all?

Ron Tisdale

[szczepan]

Hi Ron,

Where your(yoshinkan?) jo style come from?

from what I saw, Kawahara sensei jo isn't related with Saito sensei weapons at all, may be coz he is from Osaka?I think he studied some koryu school(s), stances and way of using looks like he can use it against sword or jo attack very effectively.Unfortunatly he is VERY traditional and doesn't want to teach us extensively jo to not make political problems with main line of aikikai :nono:

I don't use stainless steel jo, my jo is quite heavy and resisant, we use to hit each other vigorously.I'm not sure U can use iron jo in practice with partner.Possibly with wooden you can get faster good results in timing and rythme.

regardz

[Arashi]

Hi all.

I train Jo and Ken in every training session, on the Dojo,
but i train with my iron Jo just at home. My Sensei gave me
an advice that i should train with the iron Jo just the basic kihon, like shomen uti, yokomen uchi, shomen tsuki, etc, increasing the number of repetitions to build strenght. But he told me not to use it in the composed movementes such as hasso gaechi, for instance, or sequences as san-ju-ichi-no-kata, because it would tend to became "stiff" (pardon my english) technique. I don't know about the Ba-gua-chang, but
in Shotokan Karate the older generations used to wear an iron gueta to increase the power of the kicks and to perform certain movements gripping a large bottle full of sand on each hand, to increase the power of wrists and fingers.
The principle is really the same in all cases. Ganbatte.

Toni Rodrigues

[Ron Tisdale]

Originally posted by szczepan
Hi Ron,

Where your(yoshinkan?) jo style come from?

Response:
I'm still researching that one. I believe there may be some influence from what jo might be taught in Yagyu Shinkage ryu, but I've never seen more than a few still pics, so I'm not sure. I do know that it is *way* more precise in terms of hand positions, stances, and the use of ha, than what I've seen in other aikido styles. This means that at my level, fluidity suffers, but I hope that over time I can over come that.

from what I saw, Kawahara sensei jo isn't related with Saito sensei weapons at all, may be coz he is from Osaka?I think he studied some koryu school(s), stances and way of using looks like he can use it against sword or jo attack very effectively.Unfortunatly he is VERY traditional and doesn't want to teach us extensively jo to not make political problems with main line of aikikai :nono:

Response:
The Yoshinkan seems very strict about basic movements, and the basic techniques, but not so much about the weapons syllibus. There seems to be more freedom there to make use of the koryu exposure of individuals in the sword, jo, and knife techniques. Because its the experience of individuals that seems to be at work here, it can be a chore tracing the roots of the style.

I don't use stainless steel jo, my jo is quite heavy and resisant, we use to hit each other vigorously.I'm not sure U can use iron jo in practice with partner.Possibly with wooden you can get faster good results in timing and rythme.

Response:
I aggree, for timing and rythem you need partner practise, and fluidity. I would never use the iron jo to develop that(or for partner practise at all). It does help in many other ways though (see the other comments here). So far, the pros seem to outweigh the cons (for me anyway). Only time will tell.

regardz

[szczepan]

I'll put a question in another way:

Do any of you think "every day" (every class) jo training is necessary to achieve high level in Aikido practice?

regardz

[Gil Gillespie]

"Every day" jo training may not be necessary, but the more jo you do the better your Aikido will become! OK, why the disparity? Jo work may not be necessary in formal Aikido classes every day, but the neglecting of the jo & weapons in general over the long haul would be a serious mistake. In addition to one's formal Aikido class attendance one should develop ones own Jishugeiko (a personal DAILY training regimen), that could be stretching, or adding Aiki Taisho undo, or adding weapons &/or kata work. The more you handle a jo, the better your Aikido will be.

No coincidence. Why is the jo emphasized among O-Sensei's priorities? The bokken is self-evident. But the jo's non-delineating reversals (it has no "business" end) and connection to center, movement, extension, heightened awareness (true of all weapons) makes it a perfect training aid. My sensei once fought off an aggressive dog with a rolled up magazine using jo PRINCIPLES. As he has always said, "become familiar with the jo and you will ALWAYS HAVE A WEAPON."