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davoravo
12th March 2001, 07:31
It is quite common to see the comment "There are no blocks in aikido", yet when I am uke and Tori performs an atemi to my face I raise my forearm and BLOCK. I have tried evasions and parries but they interfere with Tori's technique and do not feel right. So I BLOCK, 100 times a session.
What does everyone think about this aspect of training? With so many repititions does blocking become a part of our natural movement and technique? Is this good? It seems to me a natural part of training (I am now very fast at blocking a close range atemi - if I know it's coming!).

George Ledyard
12th March 2001, 08:33
Well, you have stumbled on another of the great lies of Aikido practice. Nage gets to be quite knowledgeable and responds with great complexity and uke acts like a moron and falls down.

OK A bit of an exaggeration. But it is true that the way in which we generally train does not incorporate true responses from the partner. It is part of my own practice to ask my partner not to block my atemi but to deflect it and counterstrike. Although in some instances it does cause me to adjust the particular technique I was doing. But you'd be surprised how often it makes no difference whatever if he does it.

If your body movement is correct and the timing of your atemi is working with your body movement you won't be open for their counterstrike.

That said you really need to train this way by agreement. If you start doing this on the mat with people who don't train this way normally they will really hate you.

Ron Tisdale
12th March 2001, 14:29
In Yoshinkan aikido I've been taught several blocks. The japanese word used was "yoke" for block, but I've also seen it tranlated as evasion.

Most often, I see two to three levels of protection in our techniques:

block,

change your level on the vertical axis,

and change your position(on the horizontal axis).

This combination gives you contact with the uke using the block, avoids the attack if the block misses or is overwhelmed, and repositions you to complete a technique regardless. Its hard to imagine leaving more than one of these levels of protection out at any time...at least against a skilled opponent.

Is this consistant with anyone else's training?

Ron Tisdale

Den
12th March 2001, 18:01
Both Nishio Sensei and Saotome Sensei teach not to block. They teach that any strike from uke should be used to either grab or counter strike.

With this in mind Mr Ledyard brings up a good point - there is not enough instruction in henka waza or counter techniques. Any intelligent practitioner is going to realize that unless nage is really good and has uke off balance from the beginning moment, there is a counter to almost every technique. As students we need to learn and practice these counter techniques.

We don't often see henka waza in films of O'Sensei or demonstrations of the Shihan because they generally had/have uke off balance from that opening instant. O'Sensei said before his opponent even made their first strike he was behind them. For the rest of us - henka waza.
-Anthony

davoravo
12th March 2001, 23:46
George, what a great way to train!
It does seem to me that atemi has three roles;
1. the obvious - to hurt or unsettle uke
2. to occupy uke's free hand in a block (for example in kota gaeshi as he comes around the corner)
3. to be turned into a block oneself if uke does manage to get in a counter atemi

The worst thing uke could do would be NOT to block as this would be training with a dead-mind (and would not make for such an attractive countenance).

An Iwama sensei once demonstrated to me what he thought would be "real life" aikido, responding to a suprise body punch by covering the body and blocking boxer style and then redirecting the energy of the attack. The technique required some "stickiness" and collapsing (whereas normally we always extend). I saw something similar in Yoshinkan, meeting a shomen-uchi strike with a block, sticking and then redirecting. Does anyone have experience of kendo because I have a vague recollection that there is an identical movement there?

PS Den, I don't know if it was clear but I was referring to Uke blocking an atemi by Nage/Tori. Of course you could then use the energy of the atemi for henka waza.