Starting multiple martial arts at once

[twice]

There are 3 arts that I would like to start to study, Kendo, Iaido, and Seibukan Jujutsu. I just turned 31, and I'm wondering If it would be too much to study all 3 arts at once.

I started on the path of Mahayana Buddhism 4 months ago, and I like the zen qualities of Iaido, and Kendo, and the practical combat aspects of Kendo and Jujustu.

Any insight is greatly appreciated.

[twice]

Apologies if this question was posted in the wrong section.

[gendzwil]

Firstly, kendo has very little practical application in modern times.

Secondly, seibukan looks to me like just another eclectic modern thing, not sure what you are intending to get out of it. It doesn't look practical to me, just based on a quick glance at their web page.

Lots of people study both kendo and iaido. Just from a time management point of view, adding a third thing would be problematic for most. Most people can barely commit to one.

[twice]

I only meant that Kendo was practical in competition duels. There's no letting up as there is in sparring.

Seibuken Jujutsu was what I practiced when I was a kid. Turns out it's no longer offered in my area, but there is a Kokodo Jujutsu dojo.

That's true about most people not being able to commit to one. Kendo and Iaido are what I really want to learn, but for whatever reason it doesn't feel right learning those arts without learning one that isn't based on weapons.

[pgsmith]

Kendo and Iaido are what I really want to learn, but for whatever reason it doesn't feel right learning those arts without learning one that isn't based on weapons.

Not sure why not, unless you are planning on a career as a soldier for hire, in which case you'd need to learn a lot more than an unarmed art. I tend to agree with Neil in that starting three different arts all at the same time is going to be very difficult. I would advise doing only two, and then adding the third one after a couple of years when you've gotten the basics of the other two in. Even two will be hard to handle, but it would be much easier than three.

Of course, there's always the possibility that you're a natural and you'll pick it all up easily.

Good luck with whatever you choose.

[twice]

Not sure why not, unless you are planning on a career as a soldier for hire


That's just what was instilled in me as a kid.


Thanks for the replies

[jdostie]

Firstly, kendo has very little practical application in modern times.

Well, there is something very practical about learning to not freeze, and to move when something is coming at you.

[gendzwil]

Well, there is something very practical about learning to not freeze, and to move when something is coming at you.
Sure, I could list a number of practical benefits to kendo but if you are considering martial arts for self-defence it's not your first, second or third choice.

[Michael Hodge]

I'm of the pick-one-and-master-it variety, so my advice may not be worth anything if one insists of studying multiple arts at once.

At any rate, I recommend iaido only because it's what I've picked.

- M

[Ken-Hawaii]

My wife trains in kendo, MJER iaido, & SMR jodo, with dan in each. I teach judo & European fencing, & train in MJER & SMR, also with dan. So while it's not impossible to learn multiple martial arts at the same time, I sure as heck wouldn't advise starting in them simultaneously!

Ken

[CEB]

I trained Seitei Iai from my Kendo teacher while learning MJER and SMR jo. I often act out of conditioned instincts. If I have to think my technique often goes to pot. MJER really kepted trying to change my Seitei Iai. Seitai and MJER share some waza but the character is different.

Closer related the two arts are the more difficult it is for me. Judo and Karate at the sametime for example were never a problem. But I always rode the short bus to the dojo.

My Ryukyu Kobudo teacher taught Shorin Ryu. I'm a Goju Ryu guy. Shorin Ryu and Goju Ryu at the same time was bad news. It open my mind to a lot of technique and ideas but I performed both arts poorly because the two arts use different body.

[JasonNorin]

Not sure why not, unless you are planning on a career as a soldier for hire, in which case you'd need to learn a lot more than an unarmed art. I tend to agree with Neil in that starting three different arts all at the same time is going to be very difficult. I would advise doing only two, and then adding the third one after a couple of years when you've gotten the basics of the other two in. Even two will be hard to handle, but it would be much easier than three.

Of course, there's always the possibility that you're a natural and you'll pick it all up easily.

Good luck with whatever you choose.

I agree on this one. Invest some time on those 3 martial arts and with proper will, you will be proficient in all of them Take one step at a time, bro..

[Derzis]

Sure, I could list a number of practical benefits to kendo but if you are considering martial arts for self-defence it's not your first, second or third choice.
Why not? Your kiai developed by kendo will attract persons around in no time, and you will be safe. And no matter what art you practice, a good sensei will tell you to:
1. not have a posture of a victim. And you can't say kendo is teaching you 'victim' postures.
2. open your eyes around you, to avoid ... things. And zanshin is universal in any martial art.
3. best defence is when you succeed to de-escalate a conflictual situation.

[gendzwil]

Why not? Your kiai developed by kendo will attract persons around in no time, and you will be safe. And no matter what art you practice, a good sensei will tell you to:
1. not have a posture of a victim. And you can't say kendo is teaching you 'victim' postures.
2. open your eyes around you, to avoid ... things. And zanshin is universal in any martial art.
3. best defence is when you succeed to de-escalate a conflictual situation.
I didn't say kendo had no self-defence value. However, I have yet to meet a kendo sensei who had anything to say about real-world defence. We don't talk about de-escalation or situational awareness. Zanshin is not the same thing unless you are being obtuse.

[hyaku]

Why not? Your kiai developed by kendo will attract persons around in no time, and you will be safe. And no matter what art you practice, a good sensei will tell you to:
1. not have a posture of a victim. And you can't say kendo is teaching you 'victim' postures.
2. open your eyes around you, to avoid ... things. And zanshin is universal in any martial art.
3. best defence is when you succeed to de-escalate a conflictual situation.

Speaking as someone who has taught and practiced Kendo in Japan since the early 1980's it has no self defence values whatsoever. The aim is to strike protected areas. Kobudo is directed "at' those unprotected areas. Having done Karate, Jujitsu, Kendo, Iaido to a yudansha level and licenced in kobudo, kendo would probably be my last choice. If attacked a large piece of 2x2 and a dark alleyway works well. You can do more than one art but you have to spend considerable time keeping them separate and not letting one run in to the other. The better you get the harder that is to do.

[Derzis]

Speaking as someone who has taught and practiced Kendo in Japan since the early 1980's it has no self defence values whatsoever. The aim is to strike protected areas. Kobudo is directed "at' those unprotected areas. Having done Karate, Jujitsu, Kendo, Iaido to a yudansha level and licenced in kobudo, kendo would probably be my last choice. If attacked a large piece of 2x2 and a dark alleyway works well. You can do more than one art but you have to spend considerable time keeping them separate and not letting one run in to the other. The better you get the harder that is to do.

Sorry for me being blunt, but the first aim of a martial art - gendai or old - is to be able to understand your environment and act accordingly using the 'tools' that said art gave to you. It is not the mistake of the art for the lack of understanding shown by the practitioner - sensei in japan or not. It is not Kendo's fault that you did not understood the reasons why kiai exists or the reasons covered behind a posture. This sportification (yes, an invented word) of Kendo is the downfall of this art. Give the practitioner a stick and he will look for a helmet and a glove.

[Derzis]

PS "the aim is to strike the protected areas"? Interesting. I thought the aim is to understand timing, distance and breathing while swinging a sword moving, the armor is there as a necessity, not a reason. But you know better I suppose, who am I to argue with a Sensei

[gendzwil]

Sorry for me being blunt, but the first aim of a martial art - gendai or old - is to be able to understand your environment and act accordingly using the 'tools' that said art gave to you. It is not the mistake of the art for the lack of understanding shown by the practitioner - sensei in japan or not. It is not Kendo's fault that you did not understood the reasons why kiai exists or the reasons covered behind a posture. This sportification (yes, an invented word) of Kendo is the downfall of this art. Give the practitioner a stick and he will look for a helmet and a glove.This is the first aim of kendo (https://www.kendo-fik.org/english-page/english-page2/concept-of-Kendo.htm). As my sensei so often says, "if you want to learn self-defence, go learn how to shoot a gun. Kendo is about manners and spirit." Self-defence, it ain't.

[Derzis]

That is the copy-cat of the Budo Charter:

In 1987 the Japanese Budo Association was formed to uphold the fundamental principles of traditional budo. Member organizations include the Japan Karatedo Federation, the All-Japan Kendo Federation, the All-Japan Sumo Federation, the Aikikai Foundation, the Shorinji Kempo Federation, the All-Japan Jukendo (bayonette) Federation, and the Nippon Budokan Foundation. Together these organizations drafted the Budo Charter, six guidelines for the preservation of correct budo in modern martial arts:
(1) Object: The object of budo is to cultivate character, enrich the ability to make value judgments, and foster the development of a well-disciplined and capable individual through participation in physical and mental training utilizing martial techniques.
(2) Training: When practicing daily one must constantly follow decorum, adhere to the fundamentals, and resist the temptation to pursue only technical skill rather than the unity of mind and technique.
(3) Attitude: In matches and in the performance of kata, one must manifest budo spirit, exert himself to the utmost, win with modesty, accept loss gracefully, and exhibit temperate attitudes at all times.
(4) The Dojo: The dojo is a sacred place for training one’s mind and body. Here one must maintain discipline, proper etiquette, and formality. The training area must be a quiet, clean, safe and solemn environment.
(5) Teaching: In order to be an effective teacher the budo master should always strive to cultivate his own character, and to further his own skill and the discipline of mind and body. He should not be swayed by winning or losing, nor should he display arrogance about his superior skill; he should instead retain the attitudes suitable for a role-model.
(6) Promotion: When promoting budo, one should follow traditional values, seek substantial training, contribute to research, and do one’s utmost to perfect and preserve this traditional art, with an understanding of international points of view.

That remark about guns is stupid, sorry. Go, learn to shoot and go out with the gun when you do your groceries and family will pay you visits to the jail. If you want to learn self defense, first learn how to not be in situations that will require physical intervention. And if by any means you can's avoid that, end it as quick as possible. And this, ALL martial arts are teaching you. Now, you have to ask yourself is Kendo a martial art or not? Is iaido a martial art or not? And you can find sensei that will say yes, and others will say no. Your choice.

[hyaku]

Sorry for me being blunt, but the first aim of a martial art - gendai or old - is to be able to understand your environment and act accordingly using the 'tools' that said art gave to you. It is not the mistake of the art for the lack of understanding shown by the practitioner - sensei in japan or not. It is not Kendo's fault that you did not understood the reasons why kiai exists or the reasons covered behind a posture. This sportification (yes, an invented word) of Kendo is the downfall of this art. Give the practitioner a stick and he will look for a helmet and a glove.

I just described Kendo but it doesn't mean I dont teach or study other more 'practical' arts. I can assure you if you give me a piece of 2x2 I wont be looking for a helmet or glove. I certainly would not belittle Kendo for one minute as downfall. You should try it some time with the police riot squad and see how long you last. They mix it a lot.

[pgsmith]

That remark about guns is stupid, sorry. Go, learn to shoot and go out with the gun when you do your groceries and family will pay you visits to the jail. If you want to learn self defense, first learn how to not be in situations that will require physical intervention. And if by any means you can's avoid that, end it as quick as possible. And this, ALL martial arts are teaching you. Now, you have to ask yourself is Kendo a martial art or not? Is iaido a martial art or not? And you can find sensei that will say yes, and others will say no. Your choice.

You seem to be very certain that you know what you think you know. However, it seems to me that everyone else that has chimed in is pretty certain that you don't know what you think you know. Perhaps you should stop arguing and think about that a bit.

Just a thought.

[gendzwil]

That is the copy-cat of the Budo Charter: Your reading comprehension needs work. The ZNKR wrote the concept of kendo in 1975, so if anything the thing you quote is the "copy-cat". It's irrelevant at any rate: the purpose of kendo is not self-defence.


If you want to learn self defense, first learn how to not be in situations that will require physical intervention.
Absolutely.

And if by any means you can's avoid that, end it as quick as possible. And this, ALL martial arts are teaching you. Now, you have to ask yourself is Kendo a martial art or not? Is iaido a martial art or not? And you can find sensei that will say yes, and others will say no. Your choice.
Really? I find no sensei that say kendo and iaido are not martial arts. They are quintessential Japanese budo. The fact that neither of them has relevance to modern self-defence except in the most convoluted of ways doesn't change that fact.

[hyaku]

That is the copy-cat of the Budo Charter:

In 1987 the Japanese Budo Association was formed to uphold the fundamental principles of traditional budo. Member organizations include the Japan Karatedo Federation, the All-Japan Kendo Federation, the All-Japan Sumo Federation, the Aikikai Foundation, the Shorinji Kempo Federation, the All-Japan Jukendo (bayonette) Federation, and the Nippon Budokan Foundation. Together these organizations drafted the Budo Charter, six guidelines for the preservation of correct budo in modern martial arts:
(1) Object: The object of budo is to cultivate character, enrich the ability to make value judgments, and foster the development of a well-disciplined and capable individual through participation in physical and mental training utilizing martial techniques.
(2) Training: When practicing daily one must constantly follow decorum, adhere to the fundamentals, and resist the temptation to pursue only technical skill rather than the unity of mind and technique.
(3) Attitude: In matches and in the performance of kata, one must manifest budo spirit, exert himself to the utmost, win with modesty, accept loss gracefully, and exhibit temperate attitudes at all times.
(4) The Dojo: The dojo is a sacred place for training one’s mind and body. Here one must maintain discipline, proper etiquette, and formality. The training area must be a quiet, clean, safe and solemn environment.
(5) Teaching: In order to be an effective teacher the budo master should always strive to cultivate his own character, and to further his own skill and the discipline of mind and body. He should not be swayed by winning or losing, nor should he display arrogance about his superior skill; he should instead retain the attitudes suitable for a role-model.
(6) Promotion: When promoting budo, one should follow traditional values, seek substantial training, contribute to research, and do one’s utmost to perfect and preserve this traditional art, with an understanding of international points of view.

That remark about guns is stupid, sorry. Go, learn to shoot and go out with the gun when you do your groceries and family will pay you visits to the jail. If you want to learn self defense, first learn how to not be in situations that will require physical intervention. And if by any means you can's avoid that, end it as quick as possible. And this, ALL martial arts are teaching you. Now, you have to ask yourself is Kendo a martial art or not? Is iaido a martial art or not? And you can find sensei that will say yes, and others will say no. Your choice.

Well judging by your posts and a few other sarcastic remarks to some people who have already achieved high yudansha levels even headmaster of ryu you seem to be a long way from achieving what is suggested by the charter. I attended the actual seminar when this charter was issued to the public in Japanese and English and still have the original document as we were asked to check out the English translation. As the last part (6) states it's for the promotion and preservation of traditional arts. As I mentioned in another post it says BUDO not martial art.

I live in a country where they carry blades on a daily basis that they are very capable of using. I obviously avoid trouble but it's 2016. With the increase in the use of alcohol and crystal meth I can assure you no one is going to politely bow to you before attacking and a gun is the way to go.

This forum is called E-Budo and that's what we do. Best save the martial arts debate for things like BJJ.

[Brian Owens]

...That remark about guns is stupid, sorry. Go, learn to shoot and go out with the gun when you do your groceries and family will pay you visits to the jail.

Oh really? That's interesting, since I not only learned to shoot rifles at age 12 (in 1967) and medalled in competition, but also learned to shoot handguns in 1975 and to this day I carry on a regular basis...including when I go for groceries. Why would my family have to visit me in jail?

There are "stupid" remarks being made, alright, but they're being made by you.

[Derzis]

Oh really? That's interesting, since I not only learned to shoot rifles at age 12 (in 1967) and medalled in competition, but also learned to shoot handguns in 1975 and to this day I carry on a regular basis...including when I go for groceries. Why would my family have to visit me in jail?

There are "stupid" remarks being made, alright, but they're being made by you.
And you have the gun always with you right? And you will shoot whenever you will feel in danger? Nice.

[Derzis]

You seem to be very certain that you know what you think you know. However, it seems to me that everyone else that has chimed in is pretty certain that you don't know what you think you know. Perhaps you should stop arguing and think about that a bit.

Just a thought.

With what part you are not agreeing?
1. You don't have the gun on you all the time and you will go to jail before you will use it in self defence
2. best self defence is to avoid being in wrong time and wrong place
3. If you can't avoid, end it as quick as possible
4....
5....

I am asking you because I think that your condescending level is way above your real understanding level.

[Brian Owens]

And you have the gun always with you right? And you will shoot whenever you will feel in danger? Nice.

No, I don't always have it with me, but I often do. And no, I won't always shoot any time I feel in danger; only if it is necessary. You are making ridiculous assertions that have no basis in reality.

It is obvious that you are just an Internet troll, with nothing of merit to contribute.

[pgsmith]

With what part you are not agreeing?


I am not agreeing with the part where you think you understand what you're talking about. I'm also not agreeing with the part where your think your arguments make some sort of sense or have some sort of relevancy. I'm going to assume that it is a case of English not being your first language rather than going with Brian's assumption that you are simply an internet troll with nothing better to do with your time than argue with random folks on the internet.

P.S. I know a number of folks that are armed whenever they leave the house. It's not a big deal here.

[cxt]

Derzis

I hesitate to ask---but are you absolutely sure that you will have a kendo shinai on you at "all times" either?

If not and you think you don't need one because kendo teaches you "other" things.

Then why wouldn't gun training likewise also teach "other" useful things?

[Hudson1984]

In response to original question. I study two arts - judo and karate. I find that the two are complementary so training one feels like an extension rather than a difference. No strikes in judo and the club I attend doesn't really train throws or locks for karate and concentrates on strikes so I love the dual aspect.

I'm now considering looking at weapons training to round my studies off. I wouldn't suggest it from the start though. Finding complementary arts is tricky and some just don't go together a make crosstraining a nightmare. In summary it depends on the instructors and the nature of the lessons.

Oh I am also 31 and by no means an expert of anything. I'd say if you want to do it then do it but agree with advice from others. Start one for a year add another wait another year add the third. You may find that the two are covering all you want anyway or that you couldn't possibly find time for a third art

[hyaku]

I should have mentioned that I did Kendo, Iaido/jutsu, and Kobudo, a bit too close in similarity and the tend to run onto each other and you find it hard to separate them. What happens is you do something new and fill in the gaps of things you have yet to learn with things you already do from another art. But it can be handled. If arts are very different it actually helps.