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Jason Chambers
23rd February 2015, 04:56
I would like to hear some input on this...

elder999
23rd February 2015, 12:48
I would like to hear some input on this...

Incorporate as an LLC-lease space to the LLC. This is to protect your home in the event of legal action.

Provide, if possible, a space completely separate from your living space-don't use a room in your house. My dojo's in my barn.

Don't teach kids.

TonyU
23rd February 2015, 14:08
Personally, I wouldn't do it. Even with an LLC I wouldn't want to take a chance on losing everything due to a lawsuit. Even with a LLC your teaching on your property.
Also, I'm very strict on separating my hobbies and activities away from my home and family. When I'm home my time is theirs.

elder999
23rd February 2015, 22:08
Personally, I wouldn't do it. Even with an LLC I wouldn't want to take a chance on losing everything due to a lawsuit. Even with a LLC your teaching on your property.
Also, I'm very strict on separating my hobbies and activities away from my home and family. When I'm home my time is theirs.

Kind of depends on where you are, and how you conduct your business-the barn's at another end of the property, and the LLC rents it from me-this, along with insurance and the standard "quit-claim," pretty much makes my personal assets free of any liability. Someone might be able to go after me personally for some sort of negligence in my instruction, but the best protection against that is not to be....

A lot of people-a lot of really top-notch people-do this......I'm just "a lot of people," not necessarily "top-notch.":laugh:

cxt
28th February 2015, 19:51
Good advice elder!

I know at least one guy that runs his school as a "private club" instead of a "for profit" school. He says its much harder to successfully sue him for inuries should they occur and easier to keep out people he does not want to train.

Cady Goldfield
1st March 2015, 00:29
Is there a rider of some sort that one can add to a homeowner's insurance policy, that would cover liability stuff, such as slip-and-fall, etc? That's one of the things I'd want to consider too, if starting a home dojo.

Brian Owens
1st March 2015, 01:23
Is there a rider of some sort that one can add to a homeowner's insurance policy, that would cover liability stuff, such as slip-and-fall, etc?

The liability portion of the policy should already cover that, although one might want to increase the limits and such. I suspect, though, that a standard homeowner's policy would not cover liability resulting from teaching in the home; a "professions" or commercial policy would probably be required. The same principle applies to the difference between one of your kid's playmates getting hurt at your home versus an injury to a child from running a daycare operation.

elder999
2nd March 2015, 04:35
Good advice elder!

I know at least one guy that runs his school as a "private club" instead of a "for profit" school. He says its much harder to successfully sue him for inuries should they occur and easier to keep out people he does not want to train.

I keep people out that I don't want to train by contracting for training to a certain point-white belt to green is one contract, and green to brown is another, as is brown to black, though, by the time they get to that last one, I've usually been pretty certain I wanted them to stay around-the few that have made it, anyway.....on the other hand, more than once, I've come to the "green belt contract" or the "brown belt contract" and said, "You know, I don't want to teach you anymore. You should find another place to train, 'cause there's no place here for you."

just sayin': Contracts. Not all bad at all, in this day and age.Had an asshole cop actually try to sue me, back in the 90's when I was just starting to teach-wasn't gonna happen....

And, oh yeah-I don't advertise at all-you come to me, you've been or asked around some. Don't even have brochures or cards, these days....I retire and go commercial, that might change until I can't do this anymore, but in the meantime, I like to stay....particular.

It may be my barn, but it's still home, after all.

elder999
2nd March 2015, 04:53
Is there a rider of some sort that one can add to a homeowner's insurance policy, that would cover liability stuff, such as slip-and-fall, etc? That's one of the things I'd want to consider too, if starting a home dojo.

Separate policies for separate liabilities:the slip and fall should be covered by both, actually: with my property, it's entirely possible that on a day when I don't cancel classes (or don't get around to it) and there's snow in the drive, someone could slide off my driveway (road, actually) and into a tree....that'd be homeonwner's-and (based on experience) their auto insurance....or they could slip on my (unshoveled, unsalted) walkway-that'd also be homeowner's. On the other hand, they don't wipe their feet, and slip on the stairs in the barn up to the dojo? LLC insurance, all the way. My friend's broken collarbone about 13 years ago? Dojo insurance.

That last fellow, back in 2004, who thought challenging me in my own home was a good idea?

Lawyer. :laugh:

StephenBaker
2nd March 2015, 19:16
My brother is an insurance broker (45 states) and has helped a few dojo. I am trying to see if he can craft some general thoughts for me to post here. He is a busy fellow but I will try to rush this along.

jsp
7th March 2015, 22:40
like your idea but, a few things to settle:

1. Insurance third party injuries
2. enough space
3. mats on the wall aswell
4. legal issues e.g. registration, noise pollution.
5. fees to run the dojo

StephenBaker
8th March 2015, 02:24
I apologize for the delay, but my brother is getting together a blurb of thoughts to share with folks re the insurance side of a dojo. This does not constitute legal advice, but your homeowners will probably not cover much of anything related to a "dojo" injury or property issue if one occurs. We have found that many agents also cannot you what is in your own policy. This also happens if you happen to run a dojo out of another of your own businesses.

pgsmith
16th March 2015, 18:08
That would be great Stephen! There is actually very little information on-line about dojo insurance, and even less about home dojo concerns. Having your brother put something together that helps explain the basics is a terrific idea, and will be much appreciated.

Black and Blue
23rd March 2015, 04:02
You can get insurance to cover : coming and going to class, slips, falls and injuries around 35 K per student per injury, plus a couple of million on you for lawsuits. Costs a couple of hundred a year depending on how many students.If I recall, for 35 students I paid around $400.00

Phil Scudieri
www.DelawareBudokan.net

StephenBaker
23rd March 2015, 06:52
I am sorry for the delayed response. Right now I only have his sales webpage for dojo insurance. I am working on getting the broader thoughts. I am happy to post if anybody would like to see the insurance sales page. My intent was to share the thoughts without the sales bit.

StephenBaker
27th March 2015, 05:57
Here are a plethora of thoughts:

General Liability: A student could slip and fall in your studio and you could be sued for accidental bodily injury.
Accident Medical: A participant is injured during a class and has medical or dental bills.
You have a studio in your home and your home owners insurance provides NO COVERAGE because you are running a business.
Many home owners policies have exclusions for a business at your home.
You may need a certificate of insurance to get a contract or rent space.
You specifially need a policy that does NOT exclude participants
Beware of policies that exclude participants.
The dojo insurance that you can quote and buy online does not have a participant exclusion, which is the type of policy that you want.
It includes both general liability and accident medical coverage.

What if I run a dojo from my home or just have a “club”?
Your homeowners insurance probably has an exclusion for businesses operating from your home.
Even if you have a separate building for your studio, it’s still located at your home address and you still likely do not have coverage under a homeowners policy.
Just because you call it by a different name, such as a “club” that does not mean that you cannot be sued for accident bodily injuries. Just a simple slip and fall claim from a visitor to your studio could cost you your business, your savings, and more when you tried to defend it.
Let’s say this again – your homeowners insurance probably has an exclusion for businesses and possibly even one for any type of “athletic activities” on the premises.

Here is the link to the original:
https://stratuminsurance.com/dojo-insurance-martial-arts-studio-insurance/

Samurai Chrome
22nd November 2015, 10:45
This thread is awesome.

I am currently in a mission to increase the number of students. We could do another 8 to 10 more active students.

We have the right program and the sempai are all involved.

musashi
13th March 2016, 13:26
Forget about it,
Unless you have a 5th Degree Black Belt in what you're teaching, you're looking for a headache. You need to focus on a teaching certificate for the Judo or Jiu Jitsu.
There are two types of schools, The first is the school with a teacher that can hand out promotion to a certain Belt via association with a Judo, Aikido, or Jiu Jitsu school. This requires permission and licensing like a franchise.
The other school is for an introduction into self-defense as personal protection. You can teach at a local Community College and teach introduction to Jiu Jitsu for adult education and you can pay the Community College some money for using their facility as a school.
You can also go to a University or a local gym and teach there.
You need a simple course structure to teach basic competence to your students. If your students are competent and well taught, you did your best to teach.
Write a lesson plan on what your students should learn, before you start teaching classes.

CEB
14th March 2016, 17:37
Living in Illiniostan I would never do this.

ZachZinn
20th March 2016, 02:50
I've done something like this...

One of my classes right now is in someone else's home yoga studio, the other is in someone else's home dojo. The important thing is to make sure you break even. Other than that, in many ways it's preferable to room rental (which is the other thing I've done for a number of years), because you have more control over the space.

However, you have to know your location will NOT bring people in by itself. People don't get jazzed about home dojo locations like they do storefront type places. You need to always be putting yourself out there to meet interested people in order to replace the people that leave by attrition too, because you will not have advertising via just being there, the way you would in a more public spot. I have a tight knit, very dedicated group in both of my classes, one has had the same group of people for 4 or 5 years, and still eventually people move away from town, etc..so plan for it.

Understand though, running a big, commercial program from home probably ain't happening, for a number of reasons, but IME you can definitely have successful tight-knit training groups, provided you already have people that you know are dedicated enough to show up.

As to insurance, basic insurance can be had for like 4-500$ per year. I don't carry it for my classes, I just have a very good liability waiver. I did carry it when I rented public space as they required it.

BTW, I am actually married to an attorney who is normally very cautious, and she felt the waiver (well written) was enough, I can her ask her more detail if anyone is interested.