Lack of "Occidental Ryuha"

[Soulend]

Has anyone ever considered why, or had any theories as to why swordsmanship (as well as other weapons and empty-hand techniques) has been so well 'systematized' and preserved in the East, while at least prior to Elizabethan times there appears no logical system or standardized way of using the sword in Europe?

Perhaps there was or is and I'm just not aware of it.

Much like "why could one not obtain mushin, kantoku, spiritual enlightenment, et al. through boxing, Greco-Roman wrestling, or even football", I often wonder about odd things like this...

[Soulend]

Thanks! European martial arts are more popular than I knew, however my original musings are still there, as I read the AEMMA's mission statement (the AEMMA's site is linked from ejmas.com):

"The Academy of European Medieval Martial Arts or AEMMA, created in mid-1998 has, as its goals to resurrect and formalize European medieval martial arts to a similar level as today’s Oriental martial arts schools and academies.."

[Joseph Svinth]

You found the link to http://www.aemma.org . Also see:

http://therionarms.com/resources.html
http://www.etp.phys.tue.nl/bertus/schermen/types.htm
http://www.thehaca.com

Although the Confederates relegated swords to chopping firewood and holding the meat over the fire by 1862, swords remained popular in Europe until World War I, and continued to be popular in Continental university settings until World War II. What got the pointy things in the end were such things as industrialization, pogroms, World Wars, emigration to the Americas, the rise of the middle classes, and inexpensive revolvers.

For some discussion of this in Greece, see Thomas W. Gallant, "Honor, Masculinity, and Ritual Knife Fighting in Nineteenth-Century Greece," *American Historical Review*, 105:2, April 2000, at http://www.historycooperative.org/journals/ahr/105.2/ah000359.html .

For Germany, try the Schlaeger fencing, or Mensur. See, for example, Kevin McAleer, *Dueling: The Cult of Honor in Fin-de-Siècle Germany* (Princeton, NJ: Princeton University Press, 1994) and Mark Twain's thoughts at http://ejmas.com/jmanly/jmanlyart_twain_0401.htm . Hitler's favorite commando, Otto Skorzeny, did Mensur as a youth, so its attitudes are with us in the post-war era, too.

For Italy in the early 20th century, see Aldo Nadi, *The Living Sword: A Fencer’s Autobiography,* edited by Lance C. Lobo (Sunrise, FL: Laureate Press, 1995); see also http://www.ii.uib.no/~arild/fencing/book/living_sword_nadi.html .

There are probably some obscure family systems that have survived, too, especially in Gypsy/Traveller/Romany communities. However, without government, right-wing nationalist, or commercial funding, they haven't flourished, that's all. Without Jigoro Kano, Japanese MA might have gone the same way.

[Soulend]

Thanks Mr. Svinth. I will definately check those links out. So much to learn, so little time..