Interesting Picture??

[MarkF]

http://www.bestjudo.com/yokogake.jpg

This is an interesting picture of a throw which, for one reason, is so different and distinct from the waza by the same name that I learned more than thirty years ago.

It appears to be from a book by Uyenshi, given the judogi, but in the book Judo by Yokoyama, et al., it seems to be so different that I have a problem agreeing with this version being even remotely the same throw, given the similar time periods of both books on release.

Is this throw what it says it is? Is the throw in this picture the same throw pictured in the Yokoyama text?

Is it a do-able throw this way?

Mark

PS: Uyenshi described his tricks as jujutsu, just to give a reason why the same name appears under different throws.

[tommysella]

What name does the book give for this technique?

Regards,
Tommy

[efb8th]

Hi, Guys.

Looks to me like a botched Sumi Gaeshi. What do they call it?

Regards,

[BrianV]

Hello All,

Maybe a Yoko Wakare?? Although the shoulder placement is all wrong and both feet should be in front.

I'll take my change from my nickel now.....

[Ben_Holmes]

This throw does indeed come from Uyenishi's book, pg 71-73. It's listed as "Third Ankle Throw", or "Ankle Roll", then in Japanese as Yoko-Sutemi. The book also shows it in "film-strip" sequence, and it very much looks like Ukiwaza, but with a Deashibarai foot position. If Tori were catching uke's right foot with his thigh instead of his left foot, it would be quite obviously Ukiwaza.

[MarkF]

I was hoping Ben would see it, but as I couldn't get into E-budo for a day, I couldn't have given you the answer.

Apologies for leaving you hanging. But hey, Ben, on your site (I knew it had to be Uyenshi. He had the same tall, skinny uke from that book) it does say it is Yoko Gake.

But "Yoko Gake?" Even Bluming's Thai version of it is still mostly like yoko gake, but hurts a helluvva lot more.

So how did this become Yoko Gake? I read your opinion of what it resembles and agree, but how is this Yoko Gake? This was an early throw, way before Yokoyama's book, I think.

Mark

[efb8th]

Good Morning, All.

Having slept on it, I think I see the problem. This is not an action shot; it is a static pose: uke is not being thrown, and tori is not throwing. The result is what you see. Tori is on his butt, not on his side. Uke, who should be airborne, is standing on his own unbroken balance. Imagine this as an active technique. It would be Yoko Gake. The photographer just makes us work at it more than we should have to.

(But what can you expect from a picture so old they don't have pants yet?)

Good stumper, Mark.

Regards,

[dakotajudo]

After consulting Kawaishi and the Kodokan book, I would say the throw is Uki Waza. Yoko gake sends uke more to the side and rear.

However, Syd Hoare's A-Z description of yoko gake is more similar to the throw shown.

[Ben_Holmes]

Mark, On my website,

http://www.bestjudo.com/article8.shtml

I certainly did describe the photo as Yoko-Gake. And at the time I wrote that description, I was both hasty and mistaken. As efb8th points out, the static nature can be misleading. I'd written the description based only on what I was looking at!! When I saw the photo here, I never bothered to see what I'd written before, but pulled out the Uyenishi book, and analyzed it again. I'm sure now that this photo is showing a form of Ukiwaza, and not Yokogake. I can see where it could be argued either way, the position is Yokogake, but the form of the throw is Ukiwaza. But I'll chose Ukiwaza, and not be dogmatic about it.

I was hoping that nobody would notice my site until I rewrote it, since *after* writing my post, I wandered over to my site and looked at it again...

[efb8th]

Peter and Ben are both right. The missing ingredient to the Yoko gake is "Yoko Gake" the lateral dash, that kind of lifting, popping sweep we deliver as part of what we do to make yoko gake when going into Yoko Sutemi Waza of any kind. From the picture, a successful lateral dash is impossible because of the foot placement (fairly strong unbroken stance in spite of a slight forward lean).

Regards,

[MarkF]

Well, gee, Ben, I got it from your website.;)

I went through Best Judo (the book) and thought it could be sumigaeshi, but they are pretty similar.

But the Yoko gake I know is like that of Best Judo, and that was what I was going on, and of course I knew it was a static pose. Also as you surmised on your website, Ben, I also thought it Looked like Harai surikomi ashi (at least, I'm going on memory of what you said there, but I think this was one).

Yoko otoshi is still one of my favorite throws, or at least it is in my top ten or so. Hey, why not!?

Mark

This one worked great on inexperienced wrestlers I found out in my all too short wrestling days. If they don't roll, they drop right on the knee, and as this community college team was small, I got plenty of work on tall, lean guys.