PDA

View Full Version : Ranks & Uniforms in Aiki Jujutsu



Ken Allgeier
20th August 2001, 08:21
The issue of ranking in Aiki Jujutsu came up in another section, and their was no response to a statement that, in Aiki Jujutsu their is no use of the kyu/dan belt system.So I would like to ask a few questions.


1. Does legitimate/authentic Aiki Jujutsu use the 'kyu/dan' belt ranking system?


2. What is the proper uniform in the training of Aiki Jujtsu? Is it just the white dogi also used in Kodokan Judo, and when can a indivdual wear the hakama?


3.Would anybody training or teaching authentic Aiki Jujutsu wear a black Karategi and use the " red & white " obi/belt?



4. Can anybody legitimatly claim to be a " soke " in Aiki Jujutsu, who is not somehow conected to the Takeda family or the linage of Sokaku Takeda?


4a. Is their only one indivdual who can rightly claim to a " soke " in Aiki Jujutsu ?





Thank You,
ken allgeier

MarkF
20th August 2001, 12:11
I won't go near the stuff I only know a smattering, but I believe, and this from interviews of Takeda Tokimune, that the mokuroku sytem was changed to the dan-i system to relieve him/themselves of the arduous task of making the scrolls as it was about to be opened up to the world.

In Kodokan Judo, the judogi is always white or light tan, the natural color of cotton. The red and white obi given to those who have advanced to 6-dan or 7-dan are usually only worn for ceremonial reasons, but many, if not all, were black in the usual dojo work.

The blue judogi was approved for use in International Judo Federation events in 1997, and is usually acceptable wear in most dojo outside of the Kodokan, as far as I know.

As a side note, the Japan Judo Federation raised their voices loudly when this was proposed, the change from red and white teams to blue and white.


Mark

20th August 2001, 23:19
Ken,

Heck, I'll bite..........why not. This board has been slow lately without Nathan around.



1. Does legitimate/authentic Aiki Jujutsu use the 'kyu/dan' belt ranking system?

Both yes and no. Most legitament Daito ryu systems I am familiar with have adopted the kyu/dan ranking system. I believe the Daito ryu students of Yukio Sagawa have not. I am sure that the Yanagi ryu students of Don Angier have not.

2. What is the proper uniform in the training of Aiki Jujtsu? Is it just the white dogi also used in Kodokan Judo, and when can a indivdual wear the hakama?

This is not strictly standardized as far as I know. The Yanagi ryu guys always wear a hakama, usually striped. Most Daito ryu schools follow uniform formalities similar to those in aikido with the hakama symbolizing dan rank.

Would anybody training or teaching authentic Aiki Jujutsu wear a black Karategi and use the " red & white " obi/belt?

Uhhhhhh.......only if forced to! :) (That sounds more like a fashion police problem to me)

4. Can anybody legitimatly claim to be a " soke " in Aiki Jujutsu, who is not somehow conected to the Takeda family or the linage of Sokaku Takeda?

No.


4a. Is their only one indivdual who can rightly claim to be a " soke " in Aiki Jujutsu ?

No. But the term "soke" is a difficult one. Professor Bodiford has posted a very comprehensive discussion on this subject here at e-budo. Better than the term "soke" (which is really sombolic of an an administrative position) look for authentic teaching licenses or evidence of direct transmission from a recognized desciple holding such a teaching license. The term "soke" has been so abused of late as to have become virtually meaningless unless recognized as legitament by historical authorities like those at Aikido Journal or Koryu Books.

______________________


These are only my personal opinions and are subject to amendment if I am presented with new information that can be verified as accurate.


Toby Threadgill

Brian Griffin
21st August 2001, 00:47
FWIW, here is what I've observed, in my (extremely) limited exposure to Daito Ryu Aikijujitsu Kodokai:

Originally posted by Ken Allgeier
1. Does legitimate/authentic Aiki Jujutsu use the 'kyu/dan' belt ranking system?

Kodokai uses a combination of dan-i and menkyo.
Beginners wear white belts; sankyu through ikkyu wear brown; shodan & above wear black.
The first "license" is called okusandan and is awarded between sandan & yondan. The first mokuroku is awarded at that time. There are additional mokuroku, but I'm not certain when, exactly, they are given. Probably in conjunction with the various instructor ranks.
The first instructor-level rank is called jun dairikyoju, awarded between yondan & godan.
Full instructor level dairikyoju comes after godan.
Shihan is awarded some time after nanadan (if ever!)
The ultimate certification is menkyo kaiden
Holders of dairikyoju are scarce; shihan are scarcer still.
There is only one menkyo kaiden, held by Inoue Yusuke sensei, who received it from Horikawa Kodo sensei.


2. What is the proper uniform in the training of Aiki Jujtsu? Is it just the white dogi also used in Kodokan Judo, and when can a indivdual wear the hakama?

Plain white judogi through sandan.
Black hakama are worn by okusandan & above.
Women wear hakama beginning at shodan.
The shihan I've seen, and Inoue menkyo kaiden, have worn dark keikogi, but I can't recall if they were black, or a very dark indigo.


3.Would anybody training or teaching authentic Aiki Jujutsu wear a black Karategi and use the " red & white " obi/belt?

I've never seen it in Kodokai.

kimjohan
26th August 2001, 12:55
Hi.

It's off-topic but interesting I think :)

Mr. Griffin wrote:

There is only one menkyo kaiden, held by Inoue Yusuke sensei, who received it from Horikawa Kodo sensei.

I recollect reading somewhere that Inoeu sensei was awarded the menkyo kaiden by the Kodokai community after Horikawa sensei was deceased.
So my question is if Inoue sensei actually got the menkyo kaiden from Horikawa sensei while Horikawa sensei was still alive?

- Kim Johansen.