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Yamantaka
12th October 2001, 13:49
Hello!

When the red-and-white and the red belt are used :
- Red and white...from 6th to 7th Dan or from 7th to 8th Dan?
- Red Belt............from 8th to 9th or from 9th to 10th Dan?
- a bigger white belt....when one reaches the 10th Dan?
Does anyone knows for sure?
Best

tommysella
12th October 2001, 16:37
Hi!

- Red and white belt are used from 6th to 8th Dan.
- Red Belt are used from 9th to 10th Dan?

In Japan the Red and White/Red belt are only used at special occasions...while we western people tend to use them all the time...I belive there is some sort of rule that when you are going to do randori you should use your black belt instead...

White belt is never used (except for beginners :o) )...

Regards,
Tommy

MarkF
13th October 2001, 12:27
I've only known one judoka who wore a red and white, and he was a guest from Korea at my old dojo in the early seventies. Even O-Phil Porter doesn't wear it, at least he didn't the two times I met the guy, and in photos I've seen of him lately, he still wears black.

I think that kind of strutting would be frowned on anyway. But it has mostly gone the way of the ladies black belt with the white horizontal stripe, denoting mostly that it is a women's rank, but also that they know the kata better than most men.

Walt Sharp wore red/white in recent photos, but I don't know what his legitimate grade is. Last time I saw a list of USJF hachidan, they were all Japanese American. Since the IJF must approve grade above 6-dan, that list would have to be the same in all three of the judo organizations in the US. The Kodokan is a little more conservative with high ranks, but only a little.

The White belt Yamantaka refers to was something which was to allow for one who was thought to have earned more than judan, and the color was meant to signify that one would be a student again, but the width, at no less than three inches, was to imply what you all ready knew.

It was an allowance for grade above judan, but it has never been used and it is doubtful it ever will, but you never know. All sorts of things happen when this type of allowance is made but no one is supposed to get there.
*****

Basically, it is 11-dan and 12-dan.

Mark

MarkF
13th October 2001, 12:35
The criteria for those grades? Basically, they are honorary, and awarded according to what you do for judo, but mainly, it denotes age, and time devoted to judo. It is very subjective, as hard as they try to be objective.

There is no real stated criteria, but you better be perfect to advance above judan. Sainthood is the next step.:)

Mark

Yamantaka
13th October 2001, 14:40
Originally posted by MarkF
The criteria for those grades? Basically, they are honorary, and awarded according to what you do for judo, but mainly, it denotes age, and time devoted to judo. It is very subjective, as hard as they try to be objective.
There is no real stated criteria, but you better be perfect to advance above judan. Sainthood is the next step.:)
Mark

YAMANTAKA : Thank you again, Mark San! You're a DoDo!!!:kiss:
(Now, how do I attain sainthood???:look: :rolleyes: :confused:)
Best regards and back to training :toast:

dakotajudo
14th October 2001, 16:58
Originally posted by MarkF
I've only known one judoka who wore a red and white, and he was a guest from Korea at my old dojo in the early seventies. Even O-Phil Porter doesn't wear it, at least he didn't the two times I met the guy, and in photos I've seen of him lately, he still wears black.

I think that kind of strutting would be frowned on anyway. But it has mostly gone the way of the ladies black belt with the white horizontal stripe, denoting mostly that it is a women's rank, but also that they know the kata better than most men.



There is a plethora of red-and-white belts in the USJA studnet handbook. I'd attended a USJA kata clinic, where the clinician wore a red-and-white belt.

According to the most recent USJA student handbook, yodan and godan are entitled to wear red-and-balck, rokudan-hachidan wear read-and-white, and judan+ wear red belts, although that policay may have been changed on the web site.

MarkF
15th October 2001, 10:25
Yes, there are a lot of 6-dan in the USJA, but I think all three organizations would have the same higher ranks, as they must be approved by the IJF, but things change.

I learned only recently about the yondan and godan red/black in the USJA.

There is no rule forbidding it, that's for sure. I just don't have that much experience in the dojo or at the occasional tournament where a guest gives lessons/demos, no matter what the grade.

I just get "Combat Ki" goosebumps when I picture it in my head.:)

Mark

Brian Griffin
15th October 2001, 11:41
6-dan through 8-dan wear the red & white dandara obi

9-, 10-, & 11-dan wear solid red

only 12-dan wears the white obi of double width

sainthood requires at least two confirmed miracles--if you've got those, the other requirements are easy.

Yamantaka
15th October 2001, 13:46
Originally posted by Brian Griffin
6-dan through 8-dan wear the red & white dandara obi
9-, 10-, & 11-dan wear solid red
only 12-dan wears the white obi of double width
sainthood requires at least two confirmed miracles--if you've got those, the other requirements are easy.

YAMANTAKA : Thank you, Brian!
Oh, Well...Let's see : I lived all my life without money and I travelled all over the world, from Japan and Korea to Argentina, Hawaii and good ol' USA and bought two houses(since I didn't steal, that's a miracle!) and
with just two-thirds of my heart (aided by a prothesis); an extremely high blood pressure; 3 heart-attacks and two blood clots in the brain; diabetes; kidney disease; several broken bones; and goût (and if you don't know what is goût, believe me, you're a lucky guy!); I think staying alive is a very big miracle!
And now for the other requirements... :look: and then to get my white obi of double width... :D
Until then, best regards to you

MarkF
16th October 2001, 07:44
OK, Ubaldo,
You've got the miracles covered, and probably the age thing, too (I get a "touch" of gout in my back now and then), so all you have to do is study judo, learn it perfectly, lead the good and sober life (well, you've done that, and allowances for the other stuff surely would be made), you've got it as far as I'm concerned.

Do you want the three inch wide or the four inch, perhaps five?

Mark

Yamantaka
16th October 2001, 13:22
Originally posted by MarkF
OK, Ubaldo,
You've got the miracles covered, and probably the age thing, too (I get a "touch" of gout in my back now and then), so all you have to do is study judo, learn it perfectly, lead the good and sober life (well, you've done that, and allowances for the other stuff surely would be made), you've got it as far as I'm concerned.
Do you want the three inch wide or the four inch, perhaps five?
Mark

YAMANTAKA : Do you mean...studying and practicing ALL of judo??? When I thought I was already there!... :cry:
Mark San, You're despicable!:redhot:
Daffy Duck, aka