Aikido defense

[daniel fields]

Hi,
I am interested in pratcing Aikido and I am going to look at a class sometime this week, but have a few questions on the art itself that someone on this forum might help with. I have read the other posts such as is aikido good for self defense and found them interesting. But I wonder what kind of defense does a aikidoka have against a boxer that stands static and fires of a bunch of punches. I grew up either practicing boxing or martial arts and knowing that the martial arts train alot of the time defending against the over commited punch not the punch that is punched out as in boxing and brought back straight so it cant be grabbed or grappled. I have also seen some aikido demonstrations and I noticed that most attackers kind of run when they attack so they can get the momentum up for the defender to have something they can kind of deflect. It just makes me wonder how that works against a standing still fighter as the only momentum they get is in their punch. My second question is does aikido have strikes at all. I will appreciate all replies and apologize all ready if any of my question reflect what I know about Aikido (not much at all). I have only been to see one class already in my pursuit on aikido and still realize I know nothing about the art really so any help would be appreciated.

Daniel Fields:D

[Keith Mullin]

Attending a class is a good idea to get a feel for aikido. If you can attend a beginners class, that way you can see and understand what they are doing. I still get lost some times when watching the older students and Ive been studying aikido for a year now. As to defence against a static fighter, an Aikidoist would simply stay out of his range. Since aikido is a non combative art its easiest to simply avoid the problem by not being in his "range of effectiveness." That way if they want to attack you seriously they HAVE to move to do it. Another thing about attacks in the real world (off the mat) is that they usualy are very commited with lots of energy behind them, which is more than the aikidoist needs to defend themselves with. If the punch or strike does not have any real momentum behind it, its not going to be very effective in any case so simple avoidance of the strike would be enough to neutralize the attack. As to striking in aikido, we do learn it so that we can train against it, but we dont put much practice into learning to strike past the amount it takes to strike properly.

Good luck
Keith

[szczepan]

Originally posted by daniel fields

But I wonder what kind of defense does a aikidoka have against a boxer that stands static and fires of a bunch of punches. I grew up either practicing boxing or martial arts and knowing that the martial arts train alot of the time defending against the over commited punch not the punch that is punched out as in boxing and brought back straight so it cant be grabbed or grappled.
Daniel Fields:D

If you know how to fight, why are asking such simple questions? :nono:

Aikido is not for fighting. M.Ueshiba, founder of aikido, developed this art to help ppl to unified with Univers. So goal is different. Practicing only aikido one can't learn how to fight. :cry:

[daniel fields]

:saw: To Saucepan Janczuk
I dont usually post my life history but just so you understand my martial art trainning growing up wasnt much (abit of karate), but I did quite abit of boxing. I dont really understand your post you seem to have a problem with me as you assume that I can fight when I didnt even say anything like that (maybe I dont need to practice a m.a people will just assumn im a good fighter and they will stay away:laugh:). I am looking for an art that I can practice for the rest of my life so any question is important that i want to ask as I will be doing the art. To say that you dont learn how to fight when aikido is a martial art Im sorry I dont follow. Maybe it would be better to say learn how to defend. But hey you were the one trying to put words in my mouth I said nothing about wanting to learn how to fight I just asked a few basic question to help me understand but maybe you dont understand the art enough to help with a few very important questions when I was under the impression that aikido was a m.a for defense and my question was about defense. Im really confused about what u said about aikido not teaching you how to fight. If you cant fight you cant defend as simple as that because defending is fighting. I appreciate what I have read about the religious side of aikido and it interests me alot but I also wont to be able to survive if I am attacked or something so could some one help with saucepans reply on this. What do you do when someone attacks you or your family stand there and tell them your one with the universe.:nono:. If aikido is just about being one with the universe then it should be in the religious forum or something. I thought budo was kind of about acheiveing enlightenment through the practice of martial arts. i think either you or me (as im not trying to be some know it all about aikido when i dont really know that much about it) should go and look up what martial art really means.:confused:

Daniel Fields

[Keith Mullin]

I think what sausepan is trying to say when he says that we dont fight is that we dont oppose force with force, as say blocking an attack as one would do with karate. Instead we blend with the attack using the attackers own energy to control them. We try to resolve the conflict with as little harm coming to either side. When you go to observe the class, if you get the chance ask the Sensei the difference between blending and blocking, they should be able to help you with that if its confusing you. Just to forwarn you, some styles of aikido are more or less spiritual than others. Some are almost compleatly spiritual, using the physical to focus the spiritual, and others are compleatly physical. I personaly study Sedokan Aikido which I think is fairly well balanced between the two, which I like because without the the physical the spiritual lacks the strength to truely defend ones self, but the purely physical lacks a certain kind of focus offered by the spiritual. But thats just my two cents.

I have never personaly had to defend myself with my aikido physicaly, but I know people who have and they have come out with nothing more than a few bruises while not having to hurt their attackers any more than was necessary to subdue them.

Keith

[autrelle]

i would be careful not to intentionally misspell szczepan's name. it's an ethnic name, and just because you didn't want to take the time to spell it correctly, or because you did not like his reply to your question, you should not treat him with such disrespect.

surely if you posed this question to a group of people and not on the internet, you would not be so rude.

and frankly, i think that in any martial art, if you really want to learn about fighting, then go out and pick some fights. i've done it. i don't condone it. i don't recommend it to anyone, but you get your "answers" a lot faster. the dojo won't always give you the answers you seek anyway.

truly

[daniel fields]

To Autrelle,
Iam interested in whether you even do aikido. You make as much sense as szczepan know your telling me to go out and fight so I know how to fight or wether its affective, most martial arts dojos where I live near if they heard that you where fighting would be pretty upset or kick you out (rightly so). All ive heard so far is 2 people talking about fighting when if you bothered to read my first post I asked nothing about being a good fighter, but since you both wont to know im quite confident of my abilities. And also if someone entered a sarcastic (more like spastic) remark in a group other than the internet I would be more than happy to speak my mind. I wonder whether he would be so sarcastic if it was in a group other than on the internet. PLEASE ANYONE THAT WANTS TO PROPERLY READ MY FIRST POST AND HELP OUT IWOULD MUCH APPRECIATE IT. Also dont worry to much about szczepans name he is one with the universe.


Daniel Fields
(oneday i could be one with the universe):laugh:

[Yamantaka]

Originally posted by daniel fields
PLEASE ANYONE THAT WANTS TO PROPERLY READ MY FIRST POST AND HELP OUT IWOULD MUCH APPRECIATE IT.
Daniel Fields

YAMANTAKA : Well asked, Daniel!
First of all, I'd say it's not the art but the practitioner. The Budo arts were developed in the peaceful Edo Period in Japan (no wars and nothing for the samurai to do but play with pointy things and unarmed combat). There was not much efficiency or practicality, just training some "arts", a bit of "dojo storm", a bit of "fighting on the streets". And, as Musashi's history will tell you, the most important was surprise, treachery and ambushes. Ah, Yes...and luck. Today, nobody practices an "efficient" art, usable in the street or in the battle field. Some guys were just pretty lucky or their stories have been fantasized...
But, there are always people who change their practice to make them "closer" to street fights. In my humble opinion, those people wish to beat someone else and not being beaten. "Macho Men"...
Even the concept of "street fight" is elusive. Are we talking about some drunkard in a bar or a school pal trying just to beat us a little or are we talking about a thug in the street, taking us by surprise and armed with a weapon? The last one is the one who won't fight by Queensberry rules...
The real world is - when you practice a martial "art" (and I emphasize the "art") you get :
a) better health and stamina
b) better sleep and better alimentation
c) better reflexes
d) tranquility.
Will this help in a fight? Undoubtedly. Will it win the fight? I don't believe so, depending on the fight.
By all means, train Aikido (any style) and if you're interested, modify the techniques and experiment with a lot of things, not usually done (free fight with modified gloves; use of kicks and punches, etc...). You'll decide for yourself if "modified" Aikido (or any other fight) is "good for the streets" (whatever that might mean...):rolleyes:
Good luck and take care :wave:

[MarkF]

i would be careful not to intentionally misspell szczepan's name. it's an ethnic name, and just because you didn't want to take the time to spell it correctly, or because you did not like his reply to your question, you should not treat him with such disrespect.

I've written "Saucepan's" name like this many times. If he takes offense, and others are offended for him, then you can begin calling me Mr. Feigenbaum, and don't even think of mispronouncing or misspelling it. It's butchered nine out of ten times, or more, and I'm not offended in the least. If a little humor with one's name is considered "disrespectful" then all those who have misspelled my surname, even when it is right there, to copy and paste, then at least ninety per cent of you are guilty of it. I doubt it was said out of malice or disrespect especially since this person received such a warm welcome.

All settled? Good.

Daniel,
I can't tell you whether aikido is effective for street defense or not, but I can tell you how a judoist like myself would fight a boxer, and possibly come out alive. No MA, boxing, wrestling included gives one more than a slight chance in (unarmed) combat or streetfighting, but the basic rules of combat apply.

Check your surroundings for the space you have to work in as quickly as you are allowed. Check for anything which could be used as a weapon. Car keys come in handy. What they mean by blending is to let the attacker do the damage to himself. If he attacks from behind, let his own motor skills keep him coming forward and then apply the technique which will get him there as quickly as possible. Then get out if you can.

What they mean about not learning to fight is that the ideal circumstance is to stop the fight from progressing. If you're lucky, the first counter or "blending" attack will do the job. If not, well, you need to go back and survey the area again, with the same rule in mind, and attempt to stop the attack right there. If you do, you generally can get out without doing too much damage to the attacker and get yourself, and others, out relatively unscathed.

That is the most you can expect and shouldn't stick around to find out whether it worked as you wanted or not.

A judoist would fight the boxer by getting inside the boxers reach, negating his skills, and, most likely, striking and throwing him hard to the ground, and perhaps choking or setting a joint lock which puts him at the point of serious injury or to "give." Generally, broken bones aren't necessary, but it is nice if you know how. Throwing an opponent is also a blending with him. Punch at me, I parry and get to the inside quickly. I would, hopefully, let the punch carry the boxer forward by gripping the arm and throwing. I may pay dearly, but I may beat a boxer to the punch, too. If that doesn't work, there are similar techniques if the attacker pulls back. Let him go in that direction, but use a part of your body to trip, and throw backwards, toward the direction he resists. If he hits me, well, I'm praying it will be the only one.

If you wish to discuss it further, go to the Judo forum and ask the same question. This is the aikido forum and I've already taken up enough space.

Those are just basic smarts, nothing magical. There is nothing magical. All of us hope the slight advantage we spend decades learning are enough. Most have not had to find out, at least I've not had to, but I am glad I have a response if it happens.

Best Regards,

[autrelle]

Mr. Feigenbaum:

merci! you got it!

Daniel:

i've been doing MA since '89, aikido since '94. and to clarify, i was not suggesting that you yourself go out and pick fights. but i think a person who really wants to know how the stuff "really" works should go outside the dojo. O'Sensei did it all of the time, only in his time they were called challenges or matches. Shioda Sensei was also a notorious brawler, as well as Kanai Sensei and also Suenaka Sensei. Musashi is another notable. i train because i have been in fights and i know what i can learn from a dojo to ensure my safety. that's all. i wish you all the best in your quest for budo. but budo is not learning to fight (or so i have been taught). it has a primary goal of self-improvement, not the destruction of others. actual fighting is not so lofty. there are several threads from the past that recount "fight-stories." they are worth doing a search for, as they are all interesting, i think.

wow, let's all be happy.
truly

[szczepan]

Heyka Daniel,

I'm not sarcastic at all. If you did some boxing, you surly know, that to learn efficient how to fight one need some elements in his training. Such as:

1.Full contact free sparrings
2.Strategy
3.Tactics
4."Subject " sparrings to develop this or other element of technique during a combat.
5.resistance to punches (in fight to gonna be hit but must continue to fight...)
...etc....

or in aikido this kind of training tools simple doesn't exist. More, there are never "normal" (as you find in boxing or in a street) way of attacking, instead ony preset, stiff forms coming from japanees middle ages, to HELP "defender" do execute his technique. There are not misleading or faking attacks as "introduction", to create a surprise, real attack, such caracteristic in a fight with a good fighter.

Of course I know next to nothing about aikido, so don't believe me very easy. Go to the dojos, and try to find those very basic elements... You can also ask chief instructor do stand up against you, and throw few boxing punches to make him KO - just to be sure that what you going to learn is a real for "streetfighting".

hope it helps

[INFINOO]

Daniel : Welcome to E-budo. Really good question. I also like some of your points about Aikido demo,s. Whats up with those running attacks anyway? Just for the record I believe Budo is about fighting. Its not "just" about fighting but fighting is a part. I learned the majority of my Aikido from a preist and even he conceeded budo's combative nature on more than one occasion.:smash: To answer your question I feel that "pure" or tradional Aikido may not be what you are looking for. The reason is for the most part they may not know or care to teach you effective attacking meathods. And if you bring up this fact they act like you did something wrong. I beleive the attack is never wrong , and train and fight accordingly. But anyways for sure check out your local do-jo, there is bound to be somethings usefull to learn. If you find it isnt for you E-mail me and I would be glad to send you a tape on how to deal with boxer's punches. As for the holier than now types on this thread(szczepan). Some of your responses on this thread are decidedly unaiki. Is this how we treat new members with valid questions?. Do you remember a time when you were a biginner asking valid questions?. Is this how you would like to be treated? Think about it.
Gregory Rogalsky
Rogalsky Combatives International
Calgary Alberta Canada.

[szczepan]

Originally posted by INFINOO

As for the holier than now types on this thread(szczepan). Some of your responses on this thread are decidedly unaiki. Is this how we treat new members with valid questions?. Do you remember a time when you were a biginner asking valid questions?. Is this how you would like to be treated? Think about it.
Gregory Rogalsky
Rogalsky Combatives International
Calgary Alberta Canada.

Hi INFINOO,

What is aiki response please? :look: My aiki? Your aiki? Daito ryu aiki? which one? this is not quite clear for me, YET... ;)

I'm telling him a true. Naked true, not selling him marketing stuff as in publicity in very many dojo about deadly aiki techniques :laugh:

When I was beginner and asked valid questions, my sensei told me "...more practice, son, more practice..."

[daniel fields]

Hi, just a quick post to the members that helped me out with my question, it was much appreciated.

Thanks
Daniel Fields:)

[Dark_Samurai]

Szczepan, did you ever use aikido do defend yourself? If not, do you think you could defend yourself with your aikido skills?

:smokin:

Martin Leroy D, aikido de la montagne student
-"I do not fear the 10000 kicks you have practiced once; I fear the one kick you have practiced 10000 times."

[hix]

Hi Daniel,

I`d like to take a shot at your question. I think you question was geared towards the philosophy of defense in Aikido. In that respect, I have to agree with keith about range and forcing the person to commit. But there is another philosophy which deals with entering an attack. This aspect takes a lifetime.

Personally, I believe that someone interested in street defense should study as many forms of combat as possible. Aikido being one of them.

What can you get from Aikido? I think it teaches you a certain feel or sensitivity to balance and change in movement. It also helps you use the physics of body movement, which can be used in order to exert less muscular strength, but at the same time, use body mass to generate power.

You mentioned you wanted something to study for the rest of your life. Aikido is appealing to many due to the non-competitive feel in the training hall. Also, you get to wear a skirt. Just kidding.

By the way. Not all Aikido partners follow the attack. Some styles are quite strong in their attacks. It really can be quite painful.

Here are some "stlyes" to look into.

Aikikai, Iwama-Ryu, Tomiki, Ki-society (I think a little spiritual for you) Ther are plenty of others.

I study Iwama-Ryu, but I try to be open minded.

If you are really interested in studying for life, I would look into all of the forms and pick the the one that suits your lifestyle best.

There is a lot of information about the subject. Check it out and have a good time.

Good luck:toast:

Jonathan Hicks

[PRehse]

Hey Jonathan

Did you ever get to visit the Tsukuba group?

[INFINOO]

Szczepan: Please do not judge the world of Aiki by your low standards. Its unfourtunate that your teacher was reluctant or unable to explain the art in term you could understand. From my stand point as a teacher and a student of the Aiki arts " train more" is a non answer. In my training methodologies I do my best to include not only how but more importantly why. As for "one" definition of aiki how about " minimal effort for maximum effect." Hope this helps.
Gregory Rogalsky
Rogalsky Combatives International
Calgary Alberta Canada

[Derringer]

Daniel,

I did quite a bit of boxing and wrestling as a kid, and now, as an old man (52), I have a fair number of years in aikido under my belt, so perhaps I can help answer your question about dealing with a boxer.

In addition to heeding the previous good advice about controlling the distance (ma ai) between you and your opponent, think about your own experience in the ring. You know how easy it is to move into a clinch when you want to tie up the other guy's arms and make them useless (as well as hang on him to tire him out, and whisper nasty things in his ear to make him lose both his temper and his control), and you've certainly seen guys get frustrated, move in, and up-end an opponent by grabbing his legs and lifting. Aikido closes the distance in basically the same way. However, there are a few points to consider.

Aikido is not a "fighting" art, it's a martial art. That means it isn't designed to let you go toe-to-toe with another person, duking it out in order to win a contest. There is no rule saying you have to stand there fighting back while a guy jabs, feints, and hooks you.
You can move away (at a run if you have to), or you can get behind him. Once you're behind him, he's in your kitchen. Cook him with any waza you like. Or, as when you're clinching, you can move into his reach, unbalance and throw him. I agree that you do NOT try to grab a boxer's jab or feint.

The other point is that aikido, like most Japanese martial arts, presupposes that you settle a conflict from the outset--at the very first move. That means you should be in on your boxer, taking his balance, before he even gets his gloves completely raised. You move from the first moment he begins his attack--the moment he makes ANY movement into his fighting stance or comes bouncing out of his corner.

While it's nice to have an over-committed strike or punch to play with, you really don't need one. Just remember: get inside your opponent's reach or get behind him, take his balance immediately, keep him off balance as you lock or throw him. If you've waited too long and he tries to set you up with jabs, get out of his range. Make him chase you and before he can set again, move in or behind, etc.

Hope this helps.

Ernie Tremblay

[szczepan]

Very interesting post Derringer,

And what you do in a lift, or whereever there is not place to reestablish distance? Are you using thai boxing strategy?

[Derringer]

Originally posted by szczepan
Very interesting post Derringer,

And what you do in a lift, or whereever there is not place to reestablish distance? Are you using thai boxing strategy?

Szczepan,

A lift? That's a new one on me. I don't know much about Thai boxing, sorry.

But if a person moves in to clinch, even if you're against the ropes, obviously he's open to many kokyo techniques.

You might want to take a look at the first video tape in Nishio sensei's set. He has some experience with boxing, and demonstrates some ways he's found to incorporate attacks that use boxing-style punches into aikido practice.

Ernie Tremblay

[stratcat]

Mr. Fields, what Mr. Derringer says is very true, as Aikido is a "martial" art and not a "fighting", and while they may appear to be very similar concepts, their connotations, to my ear, are quite different. A fighting art may emphasize certain technical concepts that may be used by the practitioner at will, i.e. how to punch, kick, jab , etc. while a martial art may or may not teach these technical aspects, but also emphasizes the strategic application of its founding technical and philosophical precepts.

It's also unfortunately true that a fair number (not all) schools of Aikido that are "classical" (the five basic styles) use only the traditional strikes of shomen uchi, yokomen uchi and tski to teach/demonstrate the technical curricula. Having said that, these three are used, because through them the principle behind the technique applied becomes easier to teach and can be presented more clearly; certainly they don't represent the entire range of applicable possibilities that Aikido offers. This is a common misconception amongst people- Aikidoka can only defend against tski, shomen and yokomen uchi, which, like I said is not true! They are teaching tools, nothing more. It's up to the students to explore the further possibilities of the techniques they are learning.

In this sense, I believe that O'Sensei often encouraged people to attack as they pleased- surely that included many more attacks than the basic three! Needless to say, I'm sure O'Sensei never said "Oops, could you make that a Shomen Uchi, please?". The range of possibe attacks is so vast that to practice a technique against each and every conceivable form of attack would pointless- you wouldn't be able to illustrate the techniques clearly enough so the students (specially beginners) could grasp the principle behind the application in every technique. Thus- the three basic attacks.

What we do at our school, is that on sunday training (only aikiholics need apply) we practice different sorts of attacks, to see what techniques can be better applied to non- conventional attacks- a sort of Aiki -Laboratory.

In any case- always remember: the Martial Artist- not the Martial Art. :nin:

[daniel fields]

Hi,
just replying to thank everyone else for their insights and thoughts. Very much appreciated. As for you Saucepan:D It wasnt that long ago you where having a go at me about the question I asked about simple defense against boxing and you come out with your in a lift defense:laugh: you would step past the punch preferably on the out side and this I have seen done by an aikidoka. You dont have to be stepping back to blend with the attack you can also step forward to the side and blend. But hey I guess its not such a bad question cause the reason we ask ourself such questions is so that where prepared for such attacks (hence my question) but hey the guy could also pull out a gun, grenade, howitzer, bazuka, chainsaw:saw: and stinger missle :laugh:. The limitations are not in the art but in the person. Also stratcat I liked what you said about what your class does on sundays thats really sensible and sounds like heaps of fun at the same time. Thanks again everyone.



Daniel Fields
THE LIMITATIONS ARE NOT IN THE ART BUT IN THE PERSON

[Ian McDonald]

I find that the circular techniques of aikido work very well against a boxer. Saotome sensei used to show some pretty cool moves. Aikido is an infighting art and one should never grab (or really even block) an oppponent's technique. If you stay at the edge of the range of effective techniques, you'll get creamed. If you try to protect yourself, you'll get plastered. If you just move in and throw him, he won't know what happened. Always remember, it's the man not the art that you need to deal with.

Train hard.
Ian McDonald

[Aikieagle]

Let's try not to confuse BUDO with BUGEI, Budo does not mean, "martial art" nor was it meant to be an "art", it's a way. Bugei is "martial art", ive never heard my sensei call aikiDO "bugei" or "aikigei". That being said, there are two characters in Budo, BU (martial), and DO (way). Depending on the person's character, one will emphasize one more than the other. But a good aikidoka balances both. aikido's foundation is from combat, from Bu (martial). It LATER attached DO (way) to it. Then somewhere (maybe in the U.S.) some one called it martial art, but in japanese that is Bugei.
So YES aikido is combative, and it is spiritual. But one does not outway the other. And YES it is effective and easy to teach. Anyone ever heard of the ATA? (Aikido Tactical Association) They go around teaching military and law enforcement around the world the tactical version of aikido. So i dont understand why someone would say that it is not for self-defense or combat!? hell, that's where it was breed from. Anyone who knew O-sensei's life or Takeda sensei's life would know of all the fights they would get into.
Another point people should know so that we do not confuse martial art and martial way is the idea of shugyo. what does that mean? It means understanding through intense training. So if we do not train intensely and effectively, how can we "attain an understanding"? We'd only be fooling ourselves. Budo was thought to have faster results of enlightenment only because these warriors were in constant life and death situations, not b/c they were "meditating". So what is the point of finding enlightenment if we do not put ourselves in a somewhat "life or death situation". Not that we have to get in fights all the time, but we should have the intensity in class so that we can come close to those situations.
About the boxing, makes no difference. When an opponent gives you a lot of energy, you dot have to give much. But when he gives you very little, then you must create energy. "Irimi" is a concept that is ideal for boxers and kickers! I sometimes spar with some karate and kickboxing students, and i always get them with irimi right before they kick or punch. Even after their strike, you could enter as the pull back and trap their hands, after that a boxer is pretty useless. Even kickers would be out of their range b/c it's too close. ;) There is plenty you could do with aikido. And YES there are strikes. But that is not the end of the attack, just a way to open a hole to throw or pin, not the end result. hope this helped you out. Aikido is very combative, i know from experience on and off the mat, and through that it holds an understanding. Believe me, after hitting the mat after the thousandth time, i never want to get into a fight anymore. It hurts too much :) But that doesnt mean i would try to be "one with the universe" when someone is trying to kill me. that's too essoteric for me, maybe that's why im not "enlightened. :laugh: take care.

Cesar

[daniel fields]

Thanks for your post i really appreciated it. Thanks to the other members aswell. The posts answered alot of questions that i still had. . Much appreciated.

Thanks
Daniel Fields:D

[Chris Li]

Originally posted by Aikieagle
Let's try not to confuse BUDO with BUGEI, Budo does not mean, "martial art" nor was it meant to be an "art", it's a way. Bugei is "martial art", ive never heard my sensei call aikiDO "bugei" or "aikigei". That being said, there are two characters in Budo, BU (martial), and DO (way). Depending on the person's character, one will emphasize one more than the other. But a good aikidoka balances both. aikido's foundation is from combat, from Bu (martial). It LATER attached DO (way) to it. Then somewhere (maybe in the U.S.) some one called it martial art, but in japanese that is Bugei.

Hmm, I would usually translate "bugei" as "military art", but that's just me :). In any case, the standard translation for "budo" is "martial art", and the word "budo" is used in Japan in pretty much the same way that "martial art" is used in the west.

Anyway, if you ask me the differences between "bugei", "budo", and "bujutsu" have more or less been blown out of proportion in the west, the lines are much less clear in Japanese.

People call it "Aikido" because, well, that's the name that M. Ueshiba used (for a number of reasons). Why should they call it anything else?

Best,

Chris

[Johan Tibell]

Originally posted by INFINOO
Szczepan: Please do not judge the world of Aiki by your low standards. Its unfourtunate that your teacher was reluctant or unable to explain the art in term you could understand. From my stand point as a teacher and a student of the Aiki arts " train more" is a non answer. In my training methodologies I do my best to include not only how but more importantly why. As for "one" definition of aiki how about " minimal effort for maximum effect." Hope this helps.
Gregory Rogalsky
Rogalsky Combatives International
Calgary Alberta Canada
Personally I would say train more is a very good answer, especially these days when the only things Martial Artists do (or most of us anyway) is talk about how something should be done instead of actually doing it. Their (our) explanations of how it should be done have been given to us by someone else so we are simply just repeating what they said, not understanding it ourselves. So I say train more, to realization!

Regards,

Johan Tibell

[PRehse]

Originally posted by Johan Tibell

Personally I would say train more is a very good answer, especially these days when the only things Martial Artists do (or most of us anyway) is talk about how something should be done instead of actually doing it. Their (our) explanations of how it should be done have been given to us by someone else so we are simply just repeating what they said, not understanding it ourselves. So I say train more, to realization!

I'll toss in a me too here. Nothing wrong with a bit of reading, discussion and debate but in Budo the real understanding comes from doing.

The written or spoken word gives context but unless you experience what is being talked about you are prone to misinterpret. Just look at Szczepan's comments about kata and the response of those that do.
:smash:

Finally - the intellecutal component of Aikido is not all that deep. It basically boils down to a bunch of phrases and terminology that doesn't require deep mental study to understand. It does require physical practice to achieve. Most complex is the various historical relationships but understanding that is not going to make you a better or worse Aikidoist.

So train hard - read selectively. Drink beer and discuss Budo (but never on the mat).

[Mike Clarke]

Check out his lines, height of shoulders et al.
If he's just jabbing, slap his jab down and and shomen ate / palm strike to chin/nose before he brings his other punch in. If he takes up the kick boxers' "king hit pose" coming down on you, I have found stepping inside, check his hitting arm and checking his other shoulder with your other elbow as you extend into his neck collar bone area andyou wrap a hand up behind his head, then tenkan for a nice kokyu nage keeping his checked arm vined and you can put a bit of lock on it as he goes over. Uppercuts - if he's that close then all your ikkyo uras or rokyo would be useful, I reckon.
I think aikido has got lots of tools for jodan, chudan and gedan tsuki's
All the best