X-kan sword

[Bradenn]

Do you think that with the sword techniques and methods in the x-kans, one could be come a master swordsman i.e. of the same level as the Japanese masters in "pure" kenjutsu schools? Could one of us become a Musashi for example?

Or is it more a case of the sword being used as a vehicle to improve one's Taijutsu (distancing, timing)?

[paolo_italy]

Originally posted by Shojin

My personal experience in the Bujinkan sword was not very good. Most people using it like a sharp hanbo.

That's *SO* true...

[Hotsuma]

I seriously doubt that the x-kan sword style will make anyone into the next Musashi. The samurai devoted much more time to sword training than the ninja did, so naturally their sword styles would be more advanced. That being said, the x-kan sword is very good, albeit, quite different from kenjutsu. In ninjutsu, you use your taijutsu to give your strikes power, while in kenjutsu, the sword does most of the work for you.

[George Kohler]

Just for clarification, The bikenjutsu that is done in the Genbukan is not just ninpo biken.

[poryu]

HI all

The Biken in the Bujinkan is not all Ninpo either. Only the Togakure Ryu sword would be classed as Ninpo, the Kuki related sword is not Ninpo but Samurai based.

[poryu]

Hi Ric

iwa sbored and nothing else to do

thought it needed saying beofre someone tried to inply that Bujinkan sword was purely Ninpo.

You know what some people are like on this forum

have a good xmas everyone

[George Kohler]

Originally posted by Shojin
As I read through the posts, I don't see where anyone said that either kan's biken was just ninpo.. Did I miss something? or are you guy's (george and Paul) just (he he where's John and Ringo! LOL! sorry...)claifying for the sake of clairifying?

This quote below was implying that what we, "X-KAN," do ninja sword style.

The samurai devoted much more time to sword training than the ninja did, so naturally their sword styles would be more advanced. That being said, the x-kan sword is very good, albeit, quite different from kenjutsu. In ninjutsu, you use your taijutsu to give your strikes power, while in kenjutsu, the sword does most of the work for you. [/B]

[Tamdhu]

I think the Bujinkan sword training is a little more open-ended. Treating the sword like a 'sharp hanbo' can have it's advantages. While this may not lead to the next Musashi (do we really want one? What would he do? Of what use would he or she be to anyone, himself included?), I do think it's helps lead to defending one's self with all manner of things sharp, dull, long, short or whathaveyou.

The sword is studied, but not sanctified as being any holier or more important than any other weapon. That's my impression so far, anyways.

[Althaur]

I don't see any problem with using a sword like a hanbo, stiff rope or in any other manner. I think that would be a benefit to the person using it. Having a lot of other options than simply trying to cut with it. Don't get hung-up on what the weapon is "supposed" to do.

As far as taijutsu for the strikes as opposed to the sword itself; you use taijutsu by simply swinging the sword. YOu still need to usually sink or rise a bit with a cut. You still should use your body. Nobody just stood there and let the sword fall. They needed to be moving so they didn't die. Doesn't matter if it was a Samurai or a Ninja, they would move and probably not just rely on their swords to cut. They would have probably kicked, hit, smacked, tripped, grappled, so on and so on. And now I have completely lost my train of thought. Back for more coffee. Take care and be safe everyone.

[Bradenn]

Originally posted by Tamdhu
While this may not lead to the next Musashi (do we really want one? What would he do? Of what use would he or she be to anyone, himself included?)

I think some people missed the context here. I didn't literally mean the world needs another Musashi (if he even exisyed).

But I would like to know whether the sword training we have is enough for the top shihan to hold their own against guys like say Toshishiro Obata.

[Marc Coppens]

Dear users of this forum,

In the Genbukan it takes a lot of training and time to understand the basics of the orthodox handling of the sword.
The unorthodox stuff comes later, much later.
The reason for this is that we have to know the samurai way of using the sword as good as possible first. After all, how could one hope to survive an encounter with someone who is skilled in the orthodox use of the sword if this is not correctly understood?
"Know your enemy" is what I mean here.
I received this point of view many years ago from one of my sempai ;
Nicola D'onoffrio who is training at the hombu dojo for a very long time now.
According to Wright James shihan training with the sword is very usefull for making a strong spirit (taijutsu is for learning how to move the body correctly and bojutsu (especially rokushakubo)is for building strength).

Sincerely yours,

Marc Coppens - renshi
Tenzan dojo - Belgium

[Atreides]

I think if you find the sword training in whatever "kan" lacking and you are committed to really working with the sword, it's up to you to find someone you can learn from, then practice like hell. That might mean bringing someone in from out of town or going to them.

I don't quite get the relevance of the broad "kan" statements. To me, it's about who you can connect with and what you're willing to do to improve. Sooner or later, it's going to come down who you get to shere time with and ideally have things demonstrated on you, then you're going to have to work on the material. hopefully with a good training partner, then check back in with the instructor. The frequency of the check-in is what will vary.

If some across town or on e-budo is mediocre by your standards, what real bearing does it have on your training?

gregg eller

[Mark J. Speranza]

Hi
the answer is an absolute not really.:>)

You can become a very proficient swords person, but not on the level of the old swords man. You need to devote all your practice to sword to get to that level.
All the best
and Happy Holidays