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Thread: Zen Mind, Beginners Mind

  1. #31
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    Default Does a cow have buddha nature?

    Mu.
    joe yang, the three edged sword of truth

    "Not going to be fooled by you again Joe Yang's right you are evil and self-serving." Haiyomi

    "Give my regards to joe yang. very intelligent man." Sojobow

  2. Likes Lance Gatling liked this post
  3. #32
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    Default Oh and Joe...

    Oh master of internet dairy research, could you confirm Wisconsin's motto? Is it really "eat cheese or die"?
    joe yang, the three edged sword of truth

    "Not going to be fooled by you again Joe Yang's right you are evil and self-serving." Haiyomi

    "Give my regards to joe yang. very intelligent man." Sojobow

  4. #33
    wendy ongaro Guest

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    O.K. Here is a koan that gives me a little trouble.

    Heaven and Earth are not humane. They regard the ten thousand things as straw dogs.
    The Sage is not humane. He regards the common people as straw dogs.

    The space between Heaven and Earth- is it not like a bellows?
    It is empty and yet not depleted:
    Move it and more always comes out.
    Much learning means frequent exhaustion.
    that's not so good as holding on to the mean.

    Thoughts? Opinions? Interpretations? Bring them on....

  5. #34
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    Joe --

    That's actually from listening to the radio -- the California Cheese ads include talking cows saying "Aum." Honest.

    Wendy --

    Short version: Bliss happens. So does sh*t. Therefore, take the middle path.

    Background? Straw dogs were used in sacrifices (e.g., given exaggerated devotion), and then discarded.

    Long version: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Daoist...um/message/447 and http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Daoist...ium/message/18

    Keyword search: "straw dogs" AND humane

  6. #35
    wendy ongaro Guest

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    The second stanza was the easier to understand. I had an instinctive idea about the first- that all things were to be used and manipulated according to their nature. As mentioned in the posts you quoted, to be humane is to consciously act against one's spontaneous inclination. It is akin to not being able to say "no." because you think of yourself as a 'nice person'. You therefore lose the ability to respond appropriately in a situation.

    But the role of straw dogs in China I did not understand, and now I do.

    Thank you.

  7. #36
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    Cool Not Two

    Quote Originally Posted by captnigh View Post
    Exactly- you are in the best position when you know what the possibilities are.
    Another good part of the book is early, when he's explaining Breathing, he touches on the pitfalls of dualism. It changed my life. I read it for the first time twelve years ago, and it still sits in my mind as boldly as the day I first read it.
    Good, Bad, Right, Wrong are all concepts that exist solely in your mind.
    Hey! Confront the dualism hidden in " . . . exist solely in your mind." "Mind" is a function of brains, all brains. We do not live alone, no? Maybe: good, bad, right, wrong are "terms" that attempt to suggest entities that are not fixed or permenent . . . instead they are contingent, passing away, changing, limited, relative, USEFUL illusions (dangerous when allowed to become DELUSIONS) . . .

    This guy walked accross India and climbed to the mountaintop ashram of a famous guru.
    Plainly in need of solace, he begged for insight into the nature of reality and life.
    "Your mind is all that is real," the guru told him.
    Well. Without further consideration [hint, hint, double hint . . . ] Our dear seeker, feeling so much better, headed home.

    On the way, on the narrow path through jungle surrounding a village, he saw an elephant heading towards him, its mahout asleep. "Well," he thinks, "Since I make reality with my mind. . . . I've no need to move out of the way; no elpehant can hurt me . . ."

    Well. Six months later, after the healing ministrations of the villagers had reached a point where he could travel, very, very angry he made his way back to the guru.

    "What they hell?" said he. "You taught me that my own mind makes reality; that it is all that is real."

    "Sure!" said the guru, barely holding back his laughter. "Your own mind makes reality. But . . . so does the mind of an elephant, a mahout, a road, a jungle, a village . . . "

    Thus have I heard!

  8. #37
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    Red face Not Two

    Quote Originally Posted by wendy ongaro View Post
    O.K. Here is a koan that gives me a little trouble.

    Heaven and Earth are not humane. They regard the ten thousand things as straw dogs.
    The Sage is not humane. He regards the common people as straw dogs.

    The space between Heaven and Earth- is it not like a bellows?
    It is empty and yet not depleted:
    Move it and more always comes out.
    Much learning means frequent exhaustion.
    that's not so good as holding on to the mean.

    Thoughts? Opinions? Interpretations? Bring them on....
    Try always the Heart Sutra . . . I go to it all the time.

    Now, though: Only one universe--even if it is made up of multiverses; really only one. That is not some metaphorical notion but a solid principle to live with and by . . . more and more confirmed in contemporary science (brain and otherwise.)

    Imagine a blade sharp enough and big enough to cut accross and through the whole thing and right through me too. Step back and look and it is the SAME everywhere, from the finest to the coarsest grain. Space is something too, it is a substance as in part of the universe, as in material reality, which is the only kind of fundamental reality, just as "mind" is a significant element of "reality" and has it roots in substance.

    The cosmos is literally, inconceivably all one. It is NOT TWO.

    Full and empty are passing states--useful illusions.

    As you know the "mean" (the Greeks Golden Mean, too!) the Middle Way or Middle Path (Sanskrit: madhyamā-pratipad; Pali: majjhimā paṭipadā) suggests a non-extremist position. Not resting easy on some metaphorical fence but fully situated, incarnated, coordinated, and integrated (as ideals or perfections . . . can't be too goal focused . . .) right here and right now . . . as if this was and always will be just and only just It. Which it is and always has been and always will be . . .

    BUT. Humane behavior is still good . . . again in the limited, passing, relative, and contingent sense of the terms good and bad. Su Zhe: "Heaven and Earth are not partial. They do not kill living things out of cruelty or give them birth out of kindness. We do the same when we make straw dogs to use in sacrifices. We dress them up and put them on the altar, but not because we love them. And when the ceremony is over, we throw them into the street, but not because we hate them." I also think of Straw Man Arguments which are informal logical fallacies which use a kind of verbal slight of hand to appear to "win" an argument .. THE 10,000 things and THE common people are misrepresented as general entities . . . they are more (and less) than that. This suggests a highly transcendant and conditional ethic . . . hence, again, the need to transcend but include notions of right and wrong in our daily lives without allowing them to become delusions.

    Thus have I heard.

  9. #38
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    Default

    Meditation show You what You want. Choose carefully.
    The one who seeks, is the one who find. MatyJudo.pl

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