Ask The Atheist

[Shitoryu Dude]

Yes, based on a rather idiotic email received today from a fellow E-Budo member, I have decided to rip off a radio schtick performed by Tom Leykis. Only I won't be near as nice, polite or considerate of your feelings as he is I will be blunt, condescending, etc. This may very well end up in the NHB&G in very short order.

With any luck this will answer some of the "nagging" questions that you theists out there have about us non-believers. Be forewarned, nearly everything you have been "taught" about atheists is most likely totally wrong.

The rules are simple:

1) You get to ask a question. You will get an answer if it is relevant.

2) You may not try to argue the answer and you will be ignored if you do try. This isn't a conversion session, so if you think you can evangelize at me you can just screw off right now.

3) Only an atheist can answer the questions. That pretty much leaves it up to me, Tony, and William Tai (unless he is harboring a secret religion somewhere in all that sanity).

[kirigirisu]

Yup, I am secretly a closet member of the Church of I-don't-give-a-fcuk-Shut-the-fcuk-up.

[joe yang]

Okay, I pick number one. Does the question have to be relevant, and to what and how will I know? If I don't get an answer, does that mean the answer is irrelevant, or the question? Or if the question is irrelevant but the answer isn't, will you answer?

[Shitoryu Dude]

Quit being a dork and ask a question. Surely, someone has some nagging question about all us "heathen" atheists. Perhaps you think we are all evil, devil worshipping, democrats who perform occult rituals during the full moon or some such crap.

Typically, Sunday school teachers preach that atheists are communists, immoral, evil, homosexual and degenerate.

[A. M. Jauregui]

Since a doctrine is a set of principles presented for acceptance or belief does that make atheism a religion? A religion that's core belief is that there is no God or gods...

Something is not sitting right... Anyone care to enlighten me on atheism and its place among religions? (A short answers is preferable.)

Thanks a bunch.

religion
4. A cause, principle, or activity pursued with zeal or conscientious devotion.

atheism
1b. The doctrine that there is no God or gods.

doctrine
1. A principle or body of principles presented for acceptance or belief, as by a religious, political, scientific, or philosophic group; dogma.

The American Heritage® Dictionary of the English Language, Fourth Edition
Copyright © 2000 by Houghton Mifflin Company.
Published by Houghton Mifflin Company.

[John Lindsey]

Q- What do Atheists say during sex? Something like: Oh My Darwin?

[kirigirisu]

religion
4. A cause, principle, or activity pursued with zeal or conscientious devotion.

atheism
1b. The doctrine that there is no God or gods.

doctrine
1. A principle or body of principles presented for acceptance or belief, as by a religious, political, scientific, or philosophic group; dogma.

The American Heritage® Dictionary of the English Language, Fourth Edition
Copyright © 2000 by Houghton Mifflin Company.
Published by Houghton Mifflin Company.

Tony or Harvey might be more suited to answer this one, but I see it as more of an issue of semantics.

The O.E.D. happens to define religion thusly:

religion: n. 1 the belief in a super-human controlling power, esp. in a personal God or gods entitled to obedience and worship 2 the expression of this in worship 3 a particular system of faith and worship

Mirriam-Webster:

Main Entry: re·li·gion
Pronunciation: ri-'li-j&n
Function: noun
(1) : the service and worship of God or the supernatural (2) : commitment or devotion to religious faith or observance

Newbury House:

religion /rldn/ n. 1 [C;U] a system of beliefs in a god or philosophy of life:

Thesaurus: religion 1 a creed, faith | doctrine, theology

Cambridge Dictionary of American English:

religion
noun [C/U]
the belief in and worship of a god or gods, or any such system of belief and worship

See? Semantics.

What you need to do is agree first off on a common frame of reference. For example, defining "belief" and "faith" and whether or not the two are equated.

Based on the above set of definitions, since atheism has no worship or faith component, it's not necessarily a religion.

But that's just based on a selective set of definitions.

Damn my relativism...

[A. M. Jauregui]

I just wanted to get the ball rolling. Deep thought did not go into my question...

Atheism is not a hot topic in my book (that is why I wanted a short answer).

[joe yang]

Right, well I've always wondered what atheists teach their children?

[Heli]

Teaching about freedom of religion has a high ranking in my books. Also, knowing the difference between a non-believer and an atheist would be useful.

Quite frankly, I do not understand why some theists have to evangelize us non-believers and why some atheists choose to disrespect those who believe in any given god. I'm speaking in general here, if I may point it out. There is no point in that, because both parties end up shouting at selectively deaf people.

Also, it seems to me that most theists think that all the atheists and other non-believers will raise their children to become satanists/communists/liberals/homosexual/pick-whatever-your-against-group-of-people... I find it, if not insulting, then at least disrespecting.

So... About the teaching subject. I highly doubt the children's upbringing will be that much different from the others, except on the matter of religion or lack of it.

[kirigirisu]

Well, I suppose there would be more emphasis on personal responsibility, since there isn't any evil demonic-prince-of-darkness-type to blame for your own various indescretions and misbehavior.

Also, more cause-and-effect logic since Mister Horns-n-Pitchfork isn't to blame for things going horribly wrong with your life. It's called "You made a bunch of really bad decisions. Now deal with the consequences."

Plus anyone that needs the threat of some sort of karmic punishment in the afterlife to keep them in line in THIS lifetime might as well go back up into the trees and fling their own poo at predatory felines like the monkeys they claim they're not evolved from.

Interesting side note:

Do you know that character known as Satan originally wasn't so much the evil anti-god figure most Christians think of, but rather something more like a prosecuting attorney? The early Hebrews refered to said entity as "The Adversary," not so much an adversary of their particular diety, but rather the adversary of humanity. Said figure was the voice of the opposition, the guy who keeps reminding head honcho deity guy why humans suck and shouldn't be handled with kid gloves.

Wasn't until Judaism encountered elements of Zoroastrianism that we get this idea of diametric opposition and the various baggage that comes along with it. Then you get a whole buncha characters kind of clumped in together into the Mr. Horns-n-Pitchfork guy certain Jesus Freak elements like to fling at heathens and members of their own flock like feces.

[joe yang]

My experience in early childhood developement indicates young children are naturally born, superstious little pagans, much to the dismay of my born again christian friends. Kids are not little, rational, adult thinking clones. You can and should speak to them like adults, but don't expect them to understand like adults, however rational, patient or intelligent you may be. They will believe in some supernatural power and it won't be the one you believe in, or not, and wishing won't make it so.

Sorry, I wasn't trying to imply that aetheist where raising demon spawn.

[kirigirisu]

Which is why I'm all in favor of the "hey, let little Timmy and Jenny stick a penny in the light socket a few times. They'll learn" school of child-rearing.

Of course they're gonna come up with all sorts of neat little stories to explain why their particular universe behaves as it does, but they seem to have a much faster learning curve than the typical set-in-their-ways "Born Again" nut.

Plus kids have a tendency to switch "faiths" and fairy-tales like partners at a swingers convention. They'll stick with a particular superstition until something verifiably better comes along.

Such is the nature of the wee critters.

[Vapour]

Can you "prove" non-existence of God? If not, why *believe* in atheism?

[elder999]

Originally posted by kirigirisu
Tony or Harvey might be more suited to answer this one, but I see it as more of an issue of semantics.



Mirriam-Webster:


quote:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Main Entry: re·li·gion
Pronunciation: ri-'li-j&n
Function: noun
(1) : the service and worship of God or the supernatural (2) : commitment or devotion to religious faith or observance

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------


See? Semantics.

Merriam Webster, online:


Main Entry: re·li·gion
Pronunciation: ri-'li-j&n
Function: noun
Etymology: Middle English religioun, from Latin religion-, religio supernatural constraint, sanction, religious practice, perhaps from religare to restrain, tie back -- more at RELY
Date: 13th century
1 a : the state of a religious <a nun in her 20th year of religion> b (1) : the service and worship of God or the supernatural (2) : commitment or devotion to religious faith or observance
2 : a personal set or institutionalized system of religious attitudes, beliefs, and practices
3 archaic : scrupulous conformity : CONSCIENTIOUSNESS
4 : a cause, principle, or system of beliefs held to with ardor and faith
- re·li·gion·less adjective

Nothing like a little editing in the name of semantics, eh?
I'm more than willing to accede that atheism is not a religion...
....at least, no more than Buddhism is.
Carry on....