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Thread: Fusen ryu jujutsu

  1. #46
    MarkF Guest

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    Just a note on the accuracy of the time period, Yukio Tani began "taking all comers" in London, by 1900 or 1901. He beat virtually all of his challengers with the "triangle choke" or sangaku jime. Only when he couldn't display it did he use other methods, savoring them wisely. The following is from an article, originally printed in *Warrior Dreams* by Graham Noble and today is seen on EJMAS :
    ****

    "Yukio Tani was never too good with dates, and even the one date he did quote -- September 26, 1899, when he and his brother arrived in London at the invitation of E.W. Barton-Wright -- was wrong. Richard Bowen has established that the two came to Britain in September 1900, and were followed not long after by S. Yamamoto. Yukio Tani was to stay in England for the rest of his life, but his brother and Yamamoto returned to Japan within a year, possibly due to a disagreement on the use of jujutsu as "entertainment."

    When Barton-Wright gave his lecture before the Japan Society of London in 1901 he took along Tani and Yamamoto to demonstrate jujutsu technique. They showed the throws and locks of the art and then Yamamoto performed what seems to have been pretty much a standard feat among many of those early jujutsu pioneers. He lay on his back with his hands tied and had a pole placed against his throat. Three men on either side of the pole held it down while two stood on Yamamoto and another two held his legs in position. At a signal these ten men pressed down to prevent Yamamoto moving, but within twenty seconds he had escaped the holds and was a free man.

    At the same lecture Barton-Wright gave a demonstration of "locking" on a volunteer from the audience, the six-foot tall Lt. Douglas. "The lecturer," the report read, "a much smaller man than his opponent with the greatest of ease threw him down and in a variety of practical performances illustrated the modes of obtaining victory."
    ****

  2. #47
    MarkF Guest

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    Originally posted by Kit Leblanc
    I am still looking for that art that goes well with Judo and trains primarily in shorter edged weapons and batons (i.e. shortswords, jutte, etc.) and which trains in a manner which includes very close quarters (grappling) and gives realistic results.


    I was thinking about this as I read your post, Kit. Have you thought about SMR jo and even bringing it into the dojo?

    I know Meik and Diane Skoss use/teach jo at their judo dojo in Jersey.

    Actually, it could be played with, trying different lengths, etc. (OK, it then may not be a jo technically, but Kit did say he was looking for usefullness, and the jo seems to fit).

    Anyway, it was just a thought.

    Mark

  3. #48
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    I have to agree with Mark. In North America, probably the art that best fits your description is Shinto Muso Ryu, though you'd probably enjoy the branch of Araki Ryu that Ellis Amdur teaches. The real trick with koryu is just finding a dojo. I would also add that most of the koryu jutte/batton, short stick and short sword stuff really isn't suitable for use in 20th century Amercia. It's fast, short, brutal, and tends to aim to maim or kill. These are not results that generally go over well with the local constabulary. I feel it's better to train in stuff that has the OPTION of raising the stakes, but doesn't require it. At least if you're doing this out of a desire to have it available for street use. If you're studying out of pure interest on the other hand, then whatever you find interesting is cool.

    You'd probably love the Takenouchi Ryu, but the closest you're going to find any of that is Hawaii.

    Peter Boylan
    Mugendo Budogu LLC
    Martial Arts Books, Videos and Equipment from Japan
    http://www.budogu.com

  4. #49
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    I am reviving an old thread, as there is something I have been wondering about for a wee while now. Where was the "fusen ryu beating kodokan" story first mentioned? Everyone seems to say it these days, but I can only trace most instances to S. Cunningham (from Judo-L) or the Gene Simco book (which I haven't read yet). Surely it will be mentioned somewhere else as well. I am not saying I don't believe it happened, I would just like to know where I can learn more about it.

    Cheers,

    Mads
    Mads Gabrielsen

  5. #50
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    Ok, I find another source in EJMAS. http://ejmas.com/jalt/jaltart_Noble_1000.htm
    to be precise.

    Thank you, Mr. Svinth, for making me look stupid on a saturday night :P

    Cheers,

    Mads
    Mads Gabrielsen

  6. #51
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    Default Fusen Ryu Schools

    Are there any Fusen Ryu schools (ground fighting) still surviving in Japan? Did Fusen-Ryu master Mataemon Tanabe forward his lineage outside of Kosen Judo?

    Thanks!

    Mike

  7. #52
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    Hello.

    Well, my teacher learned Fusen ryu in Tsuyama (Okayama prefecture). His teacher was Inoue sensei. I'm sorry to say but the contact between my teacher and Inouse sensei broken off.

    Could somebody tell me if the Dojo is still active?

    Thanks.

    Michael Reinhardt
    Michael Reinhardt

  8. #53
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    Default Fusen Ryu

    Was this the newaza Fusen Ryu. From what I read only some of the Fusen Ryu schools studied newaza.

  9. #54
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    Hello.

    I´m sorry, but I don´t have any special informations abour the ryuha.
    Michael Reinhardt

  10. #55
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    Shin Mei Fusen-ryu jujutsu is still operating out of Osaka.

    Shin Mei Fusen-ryu website

  11. #56
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    Default Steve sorry to ask...

    I´m curious to know where i could find some information about the evolution and developing of the ground fighting as people understand in the modern times (Bjj, MMA). IMHO i don´t think that in Classical Martial Arts (such as Koryu) the "ground techniques" were "similar" to the ones used in Kodokan Judo or Brazilian Ju Jutsu, basically because "ne waza fighting" as is seen in Modern Judo or BJJ, was senseless in battlefield founded arts, as some Koryu are.

    My question is, i know that all the suwari waza and some "ground techniques" were developed for indoor situations as being inside a house, in the bedroom, sleeping and suddenly awaken by somebody, fighting from a sitting position or resting position ´til be able to draw your weapon or be able to stand up and take proper advantge from this position. Actually seeing the Fusen Ryu clips and doing some research on my own is confirming my theories about it...

    I would really like to know from where exactly this/these influence/s comes from and WHY people still believe about classical ju jutsu have in their curriculums "ground teachniques" as the techniques seen in Judo or BJJ.

    MY ignorance is just too much on this field.. :P:P:P

    Thanks in advance for your assitance.

    Sincerely,

    Óscar Recio
    "Any man who refers to himself as a "master" or knowlingly allows his students to refer to him as a master, isn´t one"
    Takamura Yukiyoshi
    http://www.dojotanabe.com

  12. #57
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    Oscar, who is the author of the quote--what is his background? I would actually like to put that quote on another thread. There's a guy in the Brazilian Jujitsu community refering to himself as 'master', when he is only a black belt and the most senior teachers don't call themselves master.

    My understanding that some of the Fusen Ryu schools developed ground technique--probably from suwari waza as you implied. I could easily see using juji-gatame for knife disarming if you were attacked from a prone position. From Fusen Ryu-to Kosen judo the history is know. I'm particularly curious if the Fusen Ryu school which defeated Kano is still in existence and still practicing ground work.
    Last edited by Raspado; 4th January 2006 at 16:14.

  13. #58
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    Steve, I'm particulary interested if Fusen-Ryu master Mataemon Tanabe's school is still living. The Osaka school did not list him in their lineage.

  14. #59
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    Default Raspado

    The quote is from Takamura Yukiyoshi Sensei of shindo Yoshin Ryu.

    You can find more information about him here:

    http://www.aikidojournal.com/article.php?articleID=91

    http://www.aikidojournal.com/article.php?articleID=472

    http://www.aikidojournal.com/article.php?articleID=222

    His inputs and thoughts about MA and MA practitioners are really interesting.

    Sincerely,

    Óscar Recio
    "Any man who refers to himself as a "master" or knowlingly allows his students to refer to him as a master, isn´t one"
    Takamura Yukiyoshi
    http://www.dojotanabe.com

  15. #60
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    BTW...raspado...post your full name...ok?

    Óscar Recio
    "Any man who refers to himself as a "master" or knowlingly allows his students to refer to him as a master, isn´t one"
    Takamura Yukiyoshi
    http://www.dojotanabe.com

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