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Thread: Shinto and Ninpo?

  1. #1
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    Default Shinto and Ninpo?

    I've recently become very familiar with the concept of the Kamidana before and after training, and i asked my instructor, but he had no definitive answer for me. So my question is this:

    Does one have to practice Shinto and/or Mikkio Buddhism to experience all Ninpo/Budo has to offer?

    Any thoughts would be greatly appreciated.

  2. #2
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    Default Re: Shinto and Ninpo?

    Originally posted by Gakkousei
    I've recently become very familiar with the concept of the Kamidana before and after training, and i asked my instructor, but he had no definitive answer for me. So my question is this:

    Does one have to practice Shinto and/or Mikkio Buddhism to experience all Ninpo/Budo has to offer?

    Any thoughts would be greatly appreciated.
    Here are my thoughts for what they are worth.

    From what I have seen the vast majority of Bujinkan practicioners do not practice Shinto, Mikkyo, Buddhism or Shugendo and do just fine. Nor have I seen Hatsumi-sensei stress such things in any of the publications I have seen. In fact most people I know studying Ninpo have pretty much maintained whatever religous beliefs they had prior to training. While I have not been to Japan, I cannot recall anyone who has been there coming back to tell us that these religious studies were critical to Ninpo practice.

    I know that Stephen K. Hayes had written some things about Ninjutsu's spiritual roots, but I would not call these publications a call to start studying such paths. Frankly, I think that these publications reflect more of his personal interests rather than anything required for the study of Ninpo.

    As far as the use of the Kamidana goes, that does come from Shinto and its use is fairly common in many Japanese martial arts. I always looked at it as showing respect to those who came before us and brought us our art and not as the practice of anything religous.

    That all being said, there is something to studying the culture and mindset of the people who developed this art. Getting an overview of these religous practices might give you a better perspective on and appreciaton for those who developed Ninjutsu. However, I would not recommend pursuing such religous paths in depth unless your core belief structure already follows such lines.

    If, by chance, you are interested in studying Shinto I would recommend the following:
    http://www.tsubakishrine.com

    If you are interested in Shugendo, you might want to look at:
    http://www.members.shaw.ca/Shugendo

    I hope that helps.

    Take care,
    JOhn

  3. #3
    Grey Dorsai Guest

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    John has it right. My sensei is a Buddhist priest and has explained the basic Shinto underpinnings of the Kamidana. BUT he has always STRESSED that one does NOT have to follow any of these religious beliefs to train, nor are we performing any particular religious rite in doing the Kamidana. Instead, we are showing respect to our training lineage. If one of us wanted to learn more about the more spiritual side of it, we could. But if we don't, we won't be learning any less with respect to the martial art.

    I believe we all get out what we want from the training. But we do not have to have a particular religious belief to get everything out of it.

  4. #4
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    Default Re: Shinto and Ninpo?

    Originally posted by Gakkousei
    I've recently become very familiar with the concept of the Kamidana before and after training, and i asked my instructor, but he had no definitive answer for me. So my question is this:

    Does one have to practice Shinto and/or Mikkio Buddhism to experience all Ninpo/Budo has to offer?

    Any thoughts would be greatly appreciated.
    Hi,

    Here are my own personal thoughts.

    I myself practice Shintoism for my own personal reasons, although in the Genbukan Dojo Tanemura Sensei teaches that the spiritual side of training is very important, but not really to follow one religion. The important thing is to train with an open mind and a pure heart. Ninpo has had a strong connection with Shinto / Buddhism throughout history and as we all know Takamatsu Sensei practiced both Shintoism and Esoteric Buddhism.
    Personally I beleive to experience all Ninpo / Budo has to offer, yes, you must train in the spiritual side of things, but dont get me wrong, by studying Shinto or Buddhism etc.. wont make you a better Martial artist, but it will certinally forge your heart and spirit.

    As for the Dojo Kamidana, many Kamidana in Dojo`s are just objects to focus on as most of them are empty as they have no deities enshrined in them. There is nothing wrong with this, as it is a good tool to help us concentrate and calm our mind ready to take on the training and as Grey Dorsai mentioned in his last post, the Kamidana in most Dojo are used to respect the training lineage.
    The main thing is to be happy and enjoy your training! (this is the best spiritual training you can get)

    just my pennys worth,


    Brian Carpenter

    Haruchi Umuchi Tsuzuchi !

  5. #5
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    Before getting mixed up with esoteric Buddhism and Shinto, I'd suggest either a trip to Japan or maybe familiarising yourself with the background of where these things come from. Their context is highly important, and without that, you risk misunderstanding alot. If you're interested in Buddhism, maybe see what exists locally near you. That would certainly give you a better about where things come from.

    J. Vlach

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