Sorry to disagree Steve but symbols aren't just symbols; for thousands of years they have held our attention and focus. They can encourage us to question and make us think. All I'm typing just now are symbols. When I face the manji I think about dhama because the symbol is there. Don't get me wrong, I can see all the arguements, but for an organisation like ours this new scroll is....PANTS! I suggested to Sensei a better idea would be some thick parchment to stick OVER the centre of our currant scroll. If it was thick enough the manji wouldn't show and cost-wise they could even throw in a free prit stick and still keep it under a fiver.Originally Posted by Steve Williams