Equality

[Ade]

Dear All

Gassho

Following the recent Taikai in Japan and the branch master's briefing there is much discussion going on about grading requirements and standards.

Put simply, different federations have differing opinions and are enforcing different rules and requirements for grading eligibility.

Previously I had been instructed that for 5th to 4th kyu, within the BSKF, a minimum of 3 months full membership status and 20 attendances in that period is a pre-requisite for grading.
These requirements carry on causing an absolute minimum of 2 and 1/2 years before any adult is allowed to take black belt grading.

This has always seemed very sensible and I totally agree and understand the reasons behind it, 7 year old black belts have never been credible in my book.

It now appears that there are rampant discrepancies within grading requirements and wild variance to either extreme, 1 year to black belt in some places, 3 years training before consideration to grade to 4th kyu in others.

It is clearly time for explicit rules and standardisation of requirement; otherwise we face an obvious lack of equality.

So where should the standard lie and what is a realistic expectation re standards?

Kesshu

Adrian.

[Gary Dolce]

Gassho,

This is an interesting question.

I agree that there are differences in the time it takes for advancement. Some of this is the result of WSKO rules - i.e., Japanese Kenshi in Japanese Branches have shorter time requirements for advancement than WSKO Kenshi. Some is the result of differences in Federation rules - e.g., The BSKF has 4th and 5th kyu ranks, but in most other countires, including Japan, the first grading is for 3-kyu. This kind of difference could be elimnated by making consistent rules. I think this is a good idea.

Some of the differences are the result of differences in teaching style among individual branch masters. Some might expect a little more or less apptitude to be demonstrated at each level than others. In conversations with other Branch Masters, I have heard a range of opinions about expectations to pass at each level. While we stand strive for consistant standards, I don't think we can ever eliminate some of this variation.

I always take it with a grain of salt when people tell me how long it took them to get from one level to the next. I have had a student who took 4 months to get from white belt to 3-kyu (remember this is our first grading) and another who took 1.5 years. The difference? The first came to almost every class during the period, the latter had very sporadic attendance. But that fact would probably not have come out in regular conversation. Students who have asked me why they haven't tested yet are usually very surprised to find out how few classes they have actually attended.

Even just looking at number of classes can be misleading. The student who attends 40 classes in 4 months might be ready for 3-kyu, while the one who attends 80 in a year and a half might not be.

While I think that minimum time and attendance standards are helpful at a most basic level, I think the only standards that really matter are ability to do the techniques. But even those standards should change as one advances - I would expect a 1-dan to do gyaku gote better than a 3-kyu, even though it is required on the 3-kyu exam. In general, I think that a lot of the differences between levels of skill from one kenshi, branch, or country to another lessen as people reach higher dan ranks, maybe in part because they spend more time practicing outside their own group.

[Omicron]

I agree that it's very hard to apply a blanket set of standards to every kenshi in WSKO. Grading guidlines are definitely valuable, but I generally think it should be up to senseis/branch masters to decide when a student is ready to take an exam. With so many variations in commitment, aptitude for learning, memory, previous experience, and time spent practicing outside the dojo, it seems most worthwhile to make grading decisions on an individual basis.

Having said that, as an international umbrella organization, it's important that WSKO have standards that apply federation-wide. I agree that a unified set of grading prerequisites should be brought forward, but I think grading decisions should ultimately be made by instructors student by student.

[Robert Liljeblad]

Gassho,

I believed that with 3 kyu and above there are only two different grading requirements, the WSKO and the Japanese federation. But I know for a fact that non Japanese kenshi practicing in Japan are treated with the WSKO requirements.

I have a friend who has only studied SK in Japan and never outside of Japan, he speaks Japanese fluently and when applying for sandan grading he was refused grading since he did not meet the WSKO requirements although he had never been part of the WSKO. I believe that this is something that needs to change, otherwise what rules would apply to a Japanese kenshi practicing in WSKO the Japanese rules? Is it possible that an organization that teaches that all humans are equal makes a difference of race?

In Sweden the first rank is 4th kyu and this works fine, but I think it would be a good idea also to have the same start rank world wide.

I hope that with the changes within SK and the talk about “One Shorinjikempo” these issues will be addressed!

Cordially,

Robert

[David Dunn]

It's true that there are only two requirements - the Japanese federation and WSKO (and perhaps the busen academy which is different). They are minimum requirements, and require the branchmaster's signature to be approved regardless. There has been a bit of a culture in the BSKF to have unofficial requirements, which make it take longer to take gradings (I think reflecting an even greater disparity between what was allowed for WSKO in the past). There's also a bit of intransigence towards grading on kenshi's part sometimes.

Minimum to shodan is 18 months in the BSKF.
3 months - 4kyu
3 months - 3kyu
3 months - 2kyu
3 months - 1kyu
6 months - shodan.

That's a bit too quick IMO. I'd go for 6-9 months for 1 kyu and a year for shodan, making about 2.5 years. In a university branch, I think if you train twice a week or more, and manage to get some training over vacations, then you can reasonably expect to reach shodan in your final year sometime, if you do a three year course.

[MagicElvisaj]

As I study at a Doin I am not sure of the WSKO times between grades but I do know the Japanese ones mentioned above at
3 months - 3kyu
3 months - 2kyu
3 months - 1kyu
6 months - shodan.
However I was told my my Doin Cho becuase I am a non Japanese I have to wait 6 months between grades. Non sure if that is his rule or Hombu`s rule. I am the fist Gaijin at this Doin who did not quit in the first month so my Doin cho was not sure how to deal with me as a full member. This is fine with me but I was just surprised becuase I am gaijin I have to follow different rules. I am just about to take my 1st Kyu test next week should be fun!
Aaron

[Rob Gassin]

I recall my original SK sensei explaining to us, in the mid 80's, that the reason for the discrepancy in grading intervals between Japan and the rest of the world was due to the fact that in Japan, SK was well established, well respected and the skill of its masters well documented. therefore having black belts after 2 years training was not an issue. in contrast in a country like Australia, where the art was not known and there were very few experienced practitioners, any black belt would automatically be seen as a senior representative of the art. For this reason, a conscious decision was made to extend the time between gradings to ensure that anyone reaching shodan was of a respectable standard and convey a positive image of SK. In addition, at the time, all the other respectable Japanese MAs had a 6 - 10 years interval to shodan whereas for many of the shoddy ones the interval was 2-3 years. The general public and the martial art community would therefore have viewed SK with suspicion if shodan was reached after 2-3 years.

I guess that in the US and Europe where SK has a relatively firm foothold, the reasons for extending the interval between gradings, I have noted above, are not as critical. In Australia, the situation has changed somewhat in that in most MAs, shodan can now be attained in 4 - 5 years. However, SK remains poorly known in the MA community. There are only 6 black belts, 3 of these shodan, in Melbourne (a city of over 4 million). As the 'elite' of SK in Melbourne is so small, any new blackbelt immediately becomes a relatively major representative of the art. Therefore it is imperative that they are proficient at it.

My solution to the issue of grading is simple.

1. Have a common curriculum across all federations.
2. Have equal intervals (and number of sessions attended) between gradings.
3. Each grading is referred to as a 'Level'.
4. Each Federation gets to decide on the rank of each 'Level'. What I mean by this is:

eg:
Start SK
3mths Japan 3rd kyu = Australia 5th Kyu = Level 1
3mths Japan 2nd kyu = Australia 4th Kyu = Level 2
3mths Japan 1st kyu = Australia 3rd kyu = Level 3
6mths Japan shodan = Australia 2nd kyu = Level 4
1.5yrs Japan nidan = Australia 1st kyu = Level 5
2 yrs Japan sandan = Australia shodan = Level 6

What this would mean is that the sankyu curriculum in Japan is the same as the gokyu curriculum in Australia and similarly the Japanese sandan curriculum is the same as the Australian shodan curriculum. To avoid confusion, in the curriculum, each level is given a number. Therefore when a kenshi goes to train with another Federation, he simply states his level, which would be the same from Federation to Federation.

This way no one would feel that they are not progressing as rapidly as kenshi from other Federations.

At some stage eg Level 8 - everyone gets Godan. Therefore there woud be no sandan or yondan in Australia.

[Richard Codling]

I agree wholehartedly with Rob G that there should be one common syllabus worldwide. I'm going to have to disagree with him about the simplicity of his example new system. Surely if the whole world has different levels assigned to their bukai it will make things very confusing as 'dan' means 'level' in Japanese. Also, if there's no sandan of yondan in Australia, how could the syllabus be common and when would you learn the sandan and yondan techniques?

Certainly some overhauling is necessary to bring the whole world into synch. and ensure a consistent level of technical expertise and experience across the board. The minimum time between gradings should be looked at and also the kyu grade syllabuses - both their number and content to ensure that when shodan is reached, standards are consistent as I mentioned above.

[Ade]

Dear All

Gassho

The replies are starting to provide evidence of the wide variance of standard being applied without any guidance.

Put simply a belt grading should be conducted on a standard.

That should be applied world wide to prevent accusations of a lack of equality based on race, creed, colour, gender etc.

It should be totally based on ability to perform the standard techniques set.

It is frankly ridiculous to suggest that there should be different national standards.

There is a distinct lack of equality of application, which leaves us wide open to an accusation of institutional favouritism.

Which, at the moment, appears more than justified.

Kesshu

Adrian.

[JL.]

Gassho!

In Germany there's the Japanese grading system plus a white-belt pre-exam which can't be failed or passed. I've asked a Sensei who said that it takes an average of seven years to Shodan.
Not surprisingly there's a very high emphasis on the quality of technical abilities in the DSKV.

Kesshu,
______ Jan.

[Gary Dolce]

Gassho,

I think we all agree that inconsistent standards are a bad thing. Note that it isn't just Hombu that sets inconsistent standards between Japanese and WSKO Branches - the approach used in the BSKF and some other countries is clearly inconsistent with the current WSKO standard.

I realized I left one thing out of my previous message. My understanding of what I heard at the Branch Masters meeting in Japan was that Hombu was working on a new curriculum, which would include having unified standards worldwide. I took this to mean that there would no longer be a difference between Japanese standards and the rest of the world. I assume that individual Federations would then make their own standards consistent with the Hombu/WSKO standards.

Gary

[satsukikorin]

(Gosh, I hope I get time to weigh in properly on this topic...)

I too would object to the system Rob Gassin has put forward as a suggestion. Shodan should mean the same thing throughout the world of Shorinji Kempo.

I don't object to an extended time requirement for acquisition of shodan outside of Japan, at least in countries with very small Shorinji Kempo communities (e.g. one branch only).

I do object to gaijin in Japan being counted differently from Japanese kenshi. Gaijin who have trained consistently at Japanese branches should be accorded the same standard as the local kenshi. My own experience was that my wife and I had to wait an extra three months to earn shodan (in Japan) after having taken our kyuu tests right alongside our branchmates. (Aaron, my memory--quite possibly flawed--is that for the Japanese it was 3 months between ALL ranks up through shodan, but for us gaijin it was 6 months between ikkyuu and shodan. Is it possible that your doin-cho just misread the rules?)

I think that the usage of go- and yonkyuu gradings for adults ought to be left up to the federations. But for sankyuu and beyond, everything should be standardized throughout the world.

Keep in mind, though, that as someone mentioned earlier all the standards we have are MINIMUMS that are then adjusted by the key element of branch master approval.

Hope I can post more thoughts later.

[David Dunn]

Put simply a belt grading should be conducted on a standard... It should be totally based on ability to perform the standard techniques set.

The problem is that this is against the supposed ethos of grading. It's always been said that the grading isn't testing your absolute standard, but rather how hard you've applied yourself to improving. Having an absolute standard would make things easier in one way, but it would also separate out those that have a natural technical aptitude from those that don't, and we're not supposed to do that.

Gary, I think the BSKF has always officially followed WSKO guidelines. Since it is the final say of the branchmaster, there is a natural lack of uniformity. In the past it did take seven years to get shodan, and there are those that think it still should. Mizuno Sensei uses the guidelines as a basis, and then asks about your attitude and commitment (e.g. 20 sessions over 3 years probably isn't going to get you to the exam).

[Joerg]

The problem is that this is against the supposed ethos of grading. It's always been said that the grading isn't testing your absolute standard, but rather how hard you've applied yourself to improving. Having an absolute standard would make things easier in one way, but it would also separate out those that have a natural technical aptitude from those that don't, and we're not supposed to do that.

But in the end the grading is usually not held by your branch master who knows about your development, but usually by some higher ranking Sensei, who probably sees you only a few times a year. So the only way you can be judged is by the written and technical test and the judgement of your branch master whether he allows you to test in the first place.

I think it is good that the effort and commitment a Kenshi shows should be part of the judgement during grading, but a minimum of technical ability has to be shown by everyone.

[satsukikorin]

But in the end the grading is usually not held by your branch master who knows about your development, but usually by some higher ranking Sensei, who probably sees you only a few times a year.

That's an unsupported, blanket statement, Joerg. Around here, at least, kyuu exams are given by our branch master. The nearest other branches are about 3 hours' travel away.