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Thread: Personal Protection: How Much Skill Do You Need?

  1. #1
    Samurai Jack Guest

    Default Personal Protection: How Much Skill Do You Need?

    In terms of personal protection, you don't need a high level of skill in martial arts (techniques to use). Basically, you need on the average about 5 skill sets, per each skill set 2 to 3 techniques. You also need and most importantly, awareness of your environment and planning for attack situations, and try n' true pre-conflict de-escalation skills. Any more skill set or high level skill training is over skill for personal protection against the average jerk- who is most likely not skilled in fighting if he attacks you. The chances of having a skilled fighter attack you any where is slim. The chances of a poorly skilled attacker, attacking you is high. For a good example, there is the well known vid of the martial arts dropping a pimp in the street with a basic telegraphed back fist. The martial artist didn't do a strike that was of a high level or sophistication to drop the pimp-you can tell the martial artist only need half of the skill he delivered to drop the pimp.

    The basic back fist, it’s dynamic, and application, can be learned in a few days at the most, and practiced to be a reflex in a week. It isn't a high level technique, yet just as effective to end the conflict as a high level technique.

    It was clear the pimp was not well trained in fighting as he walked right into the combative zone of the martial artist, despite the martial artist telegraphing his strike. It would have been a whole other story if the pimp was trained in martial arts at a high level of skill. The martial artist then would have needed many techniques to drop the pimp, if the pimp was highly skilled in fighting. It is evident that pimp felt he had enough slapping down women to take on the martial arts instructor.

    So, do we need to learn all those high level techniques (with all the nuances and fantastic results) to be effective in terms of personal protection? The odds of being attacked by a highly skilled fighter is very low. More than likely than encountering a highly skilled fighter, you may be confronted by some one who has had moderate training. I am delineating those who are watching and practicing a bit the moves they see on TNA, some street fighting while drinking, those who drop out of martial arts classes after 6 months, or those who buy martial arts DVDs and self-study at home. Basic skills with the above abstract skills will take care of them. What is the importance in learning high level skills in terms of personal protection?

    In my opinion, a person doesn’t need to get to a high level of skill to be effective when it comes to personal protection. You don’t need to learn a long list of kata, or the secret baffling high level skills, or every single archaic technique an art offers. That is more about politics, promotion, monetary gain, recruitment, and jumping through hoops then fighting. I think in this case it is a matter of technical de-evolution. This is the best way to go in terms of being effective technically.



    Any thoughts?

  2. #2
    Samurai Jack Guest

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    I originally posted this in the members lounge, and it was moved here. No complaining from me. I just want people to know I didn't originally post here. I think of this forum more along the lines of military and LEO (not related classical martial arts systems) related stuff. I guess it was the use of my title that got this thread moved here. Am appologized for doing that, will be more vigilant next time.

  3. #3
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    I try and keep the lounge free of serious martial art discussions, thus I moved it here. I don't want the lounge to be the default forum for posts that don't seem to fit anywheres else.

    To answer your question, I would have to respectively disagree. For one reason, there are a lot of good, street smart fighters who never took a martial arts class, but are good fighters. They have experience and confidence.

    I wish it was so easy that it only takes 5 or so techniques. My experience tells me it takes more than that, and more than just technique. Also, I try and train for the worse case scenario, always thinking that my opponent will be skilled.
    John Lindsey

    Oderint, dum metuant-Let them hate, so long as they fear.

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    Heya Jack,

    I think you're sort of on track, but focusing on techniques rather than on situational awareness could be limiting.

    Caveat: All the following is my own opinion, based on personal experience and study ... a mis-spent youth, 33+ years of budo, time spent as a cop and Soldier and involvement in studying and teaching both self deense and close quarters combat. YMMV, of course, and there are ALWAYS exceptions to any rule.

    For basic personal protection, yes, I agree that a few techniques, well-drilled and integrated, are pretty much all most folks would ever need. This does not apply to those for whom imminent violence is part of their lifestyle or career choices.

    By far, unless you're in a third-world (yeah, I know that's not PC anymore) or combat-zone locales, you're not going to NEED fighting skills.

    Outside those sorts of places or a career in a violence-related profession, self protection (vice self _defense_), in terms of situational awareness, staying out of bad places and away from bad people and taking care of your personal security are mostly all that will ever be needed.

    As I said above, there are exceptions, but, if an average person, living in a reasonably civilized locale has to engage in serious violence, something's probably gone very wrong. And those situations tend to be few and far between.

    For most people -- who are not cops, soldiers or otherwise engaged in a job field requiring proximity to and involvement in violent conflict -- a few well-trained techniques are all that are necessary ... and those will be used to resist and escape, not to stand there and fight. And they should be deployed only in extremis.

    To me, what is far more important than teaching self-defense, is teaching personal security.

    PS, vs SD, means teaching situational awareness, common sense home, auto and personal security, recognition of potentially bad situations, etc.

    It means teaching people to be aware of their actions, to be cognizant of their surroundings, to be proactive in terms of Not Getting Into Trouble, in the first place.

    It means teaching people to lock doors, secure windows, not leave Rolexes lying about on the dashboard, how to carry a handbag or rucksack (and not to carry anything that you can't stand to abandon and flee).

    It means raising awareness of how clothing affects your ability to fight and flee (and that the flight part is FAR more important to Real World personal safety and security than fighting skills).

    IF, and that's a big X-factor, Joe Average has to engage in personal violence, chances are, things have gone tits-up and all the personal security and safety preparations have failed anyway and he's going to be fighting for his life.

    At that point, John's spot-on. And therein lies the big difference between "self-defense" and close quarters combat.
    Chuck Gordon
    Mugendo Budogu
    http://www.budogu.com/

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    Chuck said it better than I could.

    BTW, that is why I like to use the term Personal Protection.
    John Lindsey

    Oderint, dum metuant-Let them hate, so long as they fear.

  6. #6
    Samurai Jack Guest

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    Quote Originally Posted by John Lindsey
    I try and keep the lounge free of serious martial art discussions, thus I moved it here. I don't want the lounge to be the default forum for posts that don't seem to fit anywheres else.
    Thanks, good to know, makes me feel more at ease. I thought, I was screwing up.

    Good replies for learning more, rather then less, pls. keep them coming either pro or con on the issue, and its greatly appreciated.

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    I'm with John and Chuck.

    Against the fellow average person, who is not fully committed in attacking you or hurting you, little skill or conditioning is needed. These would be the "drunken uncle" scenario, stupid ego stuff and punch ups that occur in bars and the like, or the overly aggressive pahandler or something. Awareness and avoidance will cover most of this. These aren't even really "fights" in my book.

    Against a motivated criminal assailant, who does not care how much he hurts you just as long as he gets paid, things really start to get dicey from there. Believing they are not trained and practiced at what they do is a mistake. They also have far less civilized compunction about doing harm to others. They will also typically be armed in some way. Your needs for an integrated combative skill set (not the same thing as "martial arts") just shot up.

    Then add drugs.

    People who have never been in a serious fight with someone tweaking on meth simply have no concept of what attributes that drug provides to people in a combative context. When the use of drugs is dismissed by instructors or pundits in forums and in self defense classes, I'd advise you to run, not walk for the door.

    Conditioning is also important if you happen to be dealing with the skilled, committed attacker. Adrenal dump will tax your muscles and your CV system, especially if you are perceiving a close quarter serious threat to limb or life. If, on top of that, the assailant is like an energizer bunny and just keeps going and going as you get more and more tired, and does not seem all that impressed with your deadly moves, you'll need the conditioning to stay in the fight. Some officers involved in these kinds of things report an overwhelming urge to just "lay down and go to sleep" during such encounters because of exhaustion. It saps your fighting spirit. Many have lived to tell the tale because they fought that urge. Others aren't here to tell us they probably didn't.

    This could very well happen to a non-officer. Its probably more likely, as the uniform and the very fact of assaulting an officer is major leap for most people - a point of no return, due to the consequences. They have less to fear against a fellow "civilian."

    Bringing us back full circle to skill: the more highly skilled the more efficient, and the less even your basic techniques will tax your conditioning.

    Martial arts can be a big help in dealing with these things, but the appropriate skills need to be extracted for SD/combatives and then integrated with modern weapons awareness, and ideally, modern weapons skills.

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