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Thread: The secret of ki, life, and asian martial arts.

  1. #61
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    One problem when talking about "body energies" and "blood clots" etc. is that the medical / scientific community and common people sometimes use very different language. In Finland people who have back pains regularly say they have "dislocated" their spine - something which irks medical practitioners who know better to no end!

    So one possibility is that these "blood clots" are not actual clots in the blood but just a description used by the archaic practitioners of hocus pocus to describe a phenomena they thought was caused by clots in the blood.

    This confusion in terminology is a thing we should always keep in mind when talking with uneducated people and a reason why people should use precise language if they know what they are talking about (and find out if they don't).

    The sceptic sites mentioned in earlier post are a good first reference places for people, as long as you take them with a grain of salt and keep in mind they are not a scientific source per se. The Finnish sceptics site has a dictionary like thing about pseudoscience and it has some pretty big inaccuracies when it comes to martial arts for example. Those writers are just common people too with their conceptions and misconceptions.
    Mika Rantanen

  2. #62
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    Default this is very funny...

    I've been away on business for a few days and came back just today. I like skeptics of science, that's what scientists are, that's why we go on and on testing theories, we're skeptical. That's really good. Everything I say about science, I have researched, and that also includes What the bleep. I researched Epigenetics, M-theory, string theory (upon which the M-theory came from), thought-forms, food sciences, neurology, and a number of other interesting sciences. First off, everything in what the bleep was done by the top people in their fields, except for that Ramtha woman. Yes, I am aware that the people who funded the movie had been from her so called school of enlightenment, but that's not actually important because everything put forth is actually scientifically verifiable, and the scientists who put them are also the best from stanford, harvard, and so on... I for one support their concept, and it seems that einstein did too. I don't have time to discuss this in length at the moment, however, here's a link for falkoni with the info that he requested, I'll be back soon for more input:-)

    http://eftkorea.net/zbxe/popup/movie.html
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    Brendan Lanza

  3. #63
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    Smile

    the fubby part i said (title) was the reaction to my post, i didn't expect much of one
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    Brendan Lanza

  4. #64
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    Default Ci - Seeing is Almost Believing...but the How don't know

    So many posts from smart and experienced folks, 'hope relating what I've seen won't displease....
    Long ago I had a chance to try "ki" (or "chi") treatment for my knee. The person doing it said it could be seen and reduced the lighting so the room was slightly dim. I saw a see-through, pale gray but thinner than smoke "line" or beam running from the palm of her hand to my kneecap. (She followed her teacher back to China a few days later so I never saw her again.)

    I had a tai chi teacher who'd been the "throwing doll" and cleaner-upperer for her Master who initially refused her as a student as she was a girl; I guess Seifoo was 7 when she began so it must have been tough. She grew up to be a hand-to-hand combat instructor for what in those days was the "Red Army." She never studied "chi gung" like "ki" for fighting, etc.
    Emigrating to Hong Kong where she led a rather active and athletic "tai chi chuan" class, one evening showing a pushaway technique, very lightly laid 4 fingers on my forearm. By class-end, there were 4 red welts on my skin: the senior students just smiled...it was normal. Another time explaining a thrust that first hid the fingers behind the other hand's cupped palm, she for a few
    seconds, almost touched the front of my loose T-shirt. That night, there was a reddening mark where the bones intersect below the breastbone, at the same height and along the same line she had stopped her fingers. Next morning, the mark was a 2" vertical purple-and-black bruise.
    In an Aikido demonstration in Japan, a teacher was showing ward-off, disarming and disabling techniques as his students "attacked" in turn, got thrown or were taken down, when one got out of synch and came in almost simultaneously with the man before him and at a sharp angle. The teacher's left arm easily flung away the first, as he turned slightly; then behind a kind of whole-body focus, his right hip moved almost imperceptively as the ill-timed student second seemed about to crash into him. I couldn't see actual contact but the student was propelled backwards 3-4 feet. If there was, it was very short: I just saw the Master's hip slightly move.
    I began budo 44 years ago with a long way still to go but I think the above were real "ki." Sorry for the long post. Pam
    Last edited by P. Hval; 6th July 2009 at 09:07. Reason: In the 5th line up from the bottom, should have been: as the ill-timed second student - not student second

  5. #65
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    Pam, you had not witnessed Chi-Ki. The mind desires to accept what it has so desired to do in a somewhat proselytized manner. Likewise seeing images od Jesus on a piece of toasted bread. (Not that I am out to use Jesus' name in vain, Im making a point.)

    Over 40 years in martial arts, and I have been to, met, many people, martial artists, shaman, gurus, etc., and the like.

    I have not known Chi-KI to exist, thus far (Only in subject-word and discussion)
    Richard Scardina

  6. #66
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    Yes, Rchard, sometimes you're right. The mind can play tricks on you. However, it doesn't normally happen more than once. Those people who say they saw Jesus in a cupcake, they only saw it once. But most people with alot of martial arts experience have seen it, ands even felt it, more than once. I have felt it several times, and using the techniques in the link I sent, which is free to use (don't say I'm selling anything) I have healed myself of unbelievable things. One of my friends heals a slipped disk with it, it has never bothered him after the third healing session. Another friend took about six months, but completely altered his bipolar, and was allowed to get off medication that he'd been on for over 7 years. Just because you haven't seen it in your experience, or wrote off what you saw as mind games, doesn't mean that they are. Nor does it give you the right to tell other people what they felt or saw, on more than one occasion (like Pam), as mind games. I'm sorry but that's just your opinion. It would be like an atheist arguing with a monotheist about God by saying, "Look I've been around for 40 years and I've never seen him." There are many people, however who say they've felt him, and know he has performed miracles in their lives. I want to stress that just because you haven't experienced something, or couldn't understand it, doesn't mean that it doesn't exist. Nor does it give you the right to tell others that their mind is playing tricks on them. I've never seen a million dollars either, but I'm positive that it's out there.
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    Brendan Lanza

  7. #67
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    it does give him the right to say it just as they have the right to say ashida kim shot them with an invisible fireball. there is no scientific proof of chi, there's lots of babble about quantum physics and things but i've never seen any theoretical physicist even mention chi. you can talk about how one person felt chi over and over and i'll show you a priest who feels jesus's presence every day, a shaman who feels nature and a homeless guy who feels a crazy demon that makes him write nonsense songs.

    Also if you want to see a million dollars have one of your chi master friends take the james randi million dollar challenge at www.randi.org
    Last edited by Baio; 13th February 2010 at 06:06.
    Dean Eichler der Zweite
    Bujinkan Keiko Dojo
    Owner www.korisuya.com Ninjutsu tools

  8. #68
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    Quote Originally Posted by brendan V Lanza View Post
    ...The mind can play tricks on you. However, it doesn't normally happen more than once.
    Unless, of course, the person is dillusional, highly suggestable, unusually naive, etc.
    Yours in Budo,
    ---Brian---

  9. #69
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    Quote Originally Posted by brendan V Lanza View Post
    I've never seen a million dollars either, but I'm positive that it's out there.
    But you have seen several $1 and know there are more than a million people out there, so it is most likely a million people with $1 each tallies up to a million dollars. The proof of the existence of this is in no way the same as Chi/Ki
    Richard Scardina

  10. #70
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    Quote Originally Posted by Baio View Post
    Also if you want to see a million dollars have one of your chi master friends take the james randi million dollar challenge at www.randi.org
    There ya go, a way to prove both things.

    Hitting two birds with one stone.
    Richard Scardina

  11. #71
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    Quote Originally Posted by Brian Owens View Post
    Unless, of course, the person is dillusional, highly suggestable, unusually naive, etc.
    The mind playing tricks on one is the standard state of Human mentality eg change blindness:
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Change_blindness
    What we think of as reality is largely a mental construct.

  12. #72
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    Quote Originally Posted by Baio View Post
    Also if you want to see a million dollars have one of your chi master friends take the james randi million dollar challenge at www.randi.org
    And if you should be so foolish as to claim that stones fall from the sky, Randi will take you into a field and wait until you show him the stones falling. Or until he gets bored and leaves.

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