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Thread: Sekiguchi-ryu

  1. #16
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    I thought I'd throw my 2 cents in as an ex-pat Aussie who has been around the koryu and jujutsu traps for a while. I don't personally know Mr Waters, but want to contribute some deductive information for people's consideration. Mr Waters is teaching a modern art called Glen-ryu - all the more power to him there - but claims to have training in Sekiguchi-ryu in the past. Most of the conjecture here is about the claim to Sekiguchi-ryu training.

    First: Ben's link indicates Mr Waters has been associated with the "Australian Jujitsu Association" at some point. Much of what I am aware of regarding the background to this association can be found on this e-budo jujutsu thread. Please note that Sekiguchi-ryu is not mentioned here.

    Secondly: None of the branches of Sekiguchi-ryu currently in existance in Japan publically list any Australian groups studying under them. Even Sekiguchi-ryu footage can be found on public Internet sites like YouTube these days, allowing prospective students to compare a prospective teacher and the art s/he claims to teach as practiced in Japan.

    Thirdly: Whenever someone makes a public claim to teach a traditional martial art, I personally expect several questions to be answered by them -

    1. Who was their teacher and what is their lineage?
    2. How long did they study, and what rank did they receive?
    3. What third-party verifiable evidence can be provided?

    The responsiblity is thus on the person making claims to back them up with evidence.

    My 2 cents.
    Last edited by Daniel Lee; 1st September 2010 at 02:59.
    Daniel Lee

  2. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by Daniel Lee View Post
    First: Ben's link indicates Mr Waters has been associated with the "Australian Jujitsu Association" at some point. Much of what I am aware of regarding the background to this association can be found on this e-budo jujutsu thread. Please note that Sekiguchi-ryu is not mentioned here.
    I responded to the thread you mentioned.
    George Kohler

    Genbukan Kusakage dojo
    Dojo-cho

  3. #18
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    Default Sekiguchi ryu

    [QUOTE=Daniel Lee;487240]First: Ben's link indicates Mr Waters has been associated with the "Australian Jujitsu Association" at some point. Much of what I am aware of regarding the background to this association can be found on this e-budo jujutsu thread. Please note that Sekiguchi-ryu is not mentioned here.

    Hi,

    Just so there is no confusion there are two jujitsu organisations (with some degree of status) in Australia.
    1. Australian Jujitsu Association
    2. Australian Jujitsu Federation (formerly Australian Society of Jujitsuans)
    I'm told the AJA is the larger (membership) of the two.

    Matt
    Matt White

  4. #19
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    Default Sekiguchi ryu - Australia

    QUOTE Guren ryu website: " The style of JuJutsu that my father taught and is still teaching at 80 years old is traditional Sekiguchi Ryu JuJutsu. This is the style that I received my black belt for. I am now a 6th Dan Black Belt."

    A biography of Eric Waters (www.angelfire.com) is in Jujitsu News (Australian Jujitsu Association), issue No.1, March 2000. I've narrowed it down and the dojo may be located on the north coast of New South Wales.

    Matt
    Matt White

  5. #20
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    Can anyone please enlighten me about Sekiguchi ryu in Australia - in particular Sekiguchiryu Batto jutsu. There seems to be a number of schools that have this name and I would be interested in particular about the legitimacy of Toshiyasu Yamada. The website: http://www.fukurou-dojo-sgr.com/toshiyasu-yamada provides some background. I note however on youtube there is also Naohiko Hayakawa who is mentioned in above posts. The youtube clips state that he is also a 17th generation headmaster but the style is Sekiguchiryu Iaijutsu. Are they two different styles or a split and who is legitimate?

  6. #21
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    Hi Grant,
    Here's what I remember in a nutshell (been a number of years since I practiced that art) ... The sword and jujutsu arts of the school ended up being sundered a number of years back (WW II maybe?), and the main jujutsu line has only recently begun to relearn the sword portion of their curriculum (not sure from where). There were several lines of the sword portion of the school that developed from Aoki Kikuo, who was the head of both Niten Ichi ryu as well as Sekiguchi ryu iaijutsu during WW II. These have resolved down to two as far as I know, the line headed by Yamada Yoshitaka (Yamada Toshiyasu is shihan in that branch) and the line headed by Yonehara Kameo. You can tell them apart mainly by the fact that the Sekiguchi ryu signature tobiichigai is actually a jumping foot switch in the Yamada line, whereas it is more of a standing foot switch in the Yonehara line.

    I've no idea who the fellow is in the old post that started this thread. He has had some connection with Sekiguchi ryu, as evidence by the style of noto that he does. Nothing else looks really reasonable as a sword art, never mind Sekiguchi ryu. There are plenty of other videos of Sekiguchi ryu that you can compare it to.

    Please bear in mind that I have NO authority to speak for the school, I am no longer associated with the school (medical reasons), and any mistakes in my recap are due to my faulty memory.

    Hope that helps a little.
    Last edited by pgsmith; 21st March 2015 at 03:35.

  7. #22
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    Thanks Paul it all helps. It is difficult to know who is who in terms of authority/legitimacy so your experience is appreciated!
    Kind regards
    Grant

  8. #23
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    It is difficult. That's why I feel that there is still a need for places like e-budo where people can come and ask questions.
    Give it a shot if possible. It's a very dynamic art and I greatly enjoyed it.

  9. #24
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    Cool

    Quote Originally Posted by pgsmith View Post
    It is difficult. That's why I feel that there is still a need for places like e-budo where people can come and ask questions.
    Give it a shot if possible. It's a very dynamic art and I greatly enjoyed it.
    Hey Paul, hope you are doing well. You probably don't remember, but you actually met Hayakawa when he was brought to Tucson in '04 as interpreter for Yamada Soke. There was a huge falling out, and he later made illegitimate claim to some inheritance of the art, which is totally refuted by just about all in the JSA community, especially Yamada Soke and McClafferty Hanshi.

    I know this is an old thread, but had to throw my two pence in the pot!
    Kaishinkan Dojo
    “The true science of martial arts means practicing them in such a way that they will be useful at any time,
    and to teach them in such a way that they will be useful in all things.”

  10. #25
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    Hey John, good to hear from you!
    I clearly remember the guy that was the "interpreter" Didn't know that this was the guy in the original post though. That doesn't surprise me that he would try and make himself out to be something he's not, as he seemed pretty attention oriented at the time.

    Hope everything's going well for you my friend!
    Paul Smith
    "Always keep the sharp side and the pointy end between you and your opponent"

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