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Thread: Hosokawake Dento Niten Ichi Ryu?

  1. #1
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    Default Hosokawake Dento Niten Ichi Ryu?

    Happy New Year everyone!

    With all of my free time over the winter vacation, I finally got around to organizing my photos and videos from embu and taikai that I've watched over the past 2 years. I've got a question.

    At the Shimogamo Jinja embu in Kyoto during Golden Week, I watched a Niten Ichi Ryu group perform both years that I went. The program I have lists them as 細川家伝統兵法二天一流 (Hosokawa-ke Dento Hyoho Niten Ichi Ryu). That name surprised me. I did a quick google search, but there was nothing in English and my kanji skills aren't really up for more than a superficial search in Japanese. They seem to have come up on this forum once a decade ago, but there wasn't much discussion in that thread. Did anyone else see those embu or otherwise know anything about them? I'd assume they're a group that splintered off at some point, but I was surprised that they'd be at a big koryu gathering like Shimogamo.

    Just curious, but its been bugging me!

    Thanks,

    Mel Hayashi

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    Is this the video of what you saw?
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Jm7ZX8tsE_c

    Very interesting, thanks

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    That's because you need check location of origin! The old province name was Higo ie modern day Kumamoto on Kyushu! Hosokawa
    was the ruling family for that area! So group is saying that this line/ art was associated with this family, clan, and area persay!
    Jeff Collier

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    Hi Carina,

    Yeah, that looks like them. Actually, it has to be. Video says May 4, 2012 so I was definitely there somewhere watching this.

    Mel Hayashi

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    Hi Jeff,

    Yeah, the Hosokawa name seems to get attached to a lot of things here in Kyushu since they're tied to Kokura up north and Kumamoto to the south. Actually that's why the name surprised me. Musashi was employed by Hosokawa Tadatoshi late in life, at least until the latters death. Does this imply that the style (or a version of it) was passed down through the Hosokawa family line too?

    Mel Hayashi

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    To be honest I can not tell you, it is not my ryuha. Again could be show connection, could show that it was passed down through clan and associated members! Best source is to ask a member w/ in the ryuha!!!
    Jeff Collier

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    Hi,

    From what I remember, the Hosokawa branch was formed after splitting from the main line 3 generations ago or so, and is run by Miyata (Kazuhiro) sensei.
    I had the chance of meeting him several years ago during an enbu in Kumamoto; he's a very nice gentleman and has amazing skills!
    Anyone interested in Niten Ichi ryu should definitely go see him in Fukuoka.

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    Interesting! Thanks Jon! They are based in Dazaifu, but seem to have a few dojos in the city. I think curiosity is going to get the better of me!

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    Quote Originally Posted by Ookami7 View Post
    To be honest I can not tell you, it is not my ryuha. Again could be show connection, could show that it was passed down through clan and associated members! Best source is to ask a member w/ in the ryuha!!!
    Well you could ask the moderator.
    Hyakutake Colin

    All the best techniques are taught by survivors.


    http://www.hyoho.com

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    I was hoping you'd show up and have some input into this Colin sensei. So, what does the main line say about the Hosokawa branch, if you don't mind my asking?
    Paul Smith
    "Always keep the sharp side and the pointy end between you and your opponent"

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    Quote Originally Posted by pgsmith View Post
    I was hoping you'd show up and have some input into this Colin sensei. So, what does the main line say about the Hosokawa branch, if you don't mind my asking?
    Lol nothing, we don't have branches. Apart from us Noda Ha has documents.

    The 8th Soke was also leader of a ju jitsu Ryu (Sekiguchi). With the 11th Soke taking over this link was cut. One of the Imai Sokes students (Kiyonaga Fumiya) went off to go it alone but actually died before Imai Some leaving his people leaderless. Hence the reestablished connection seeking recognition. Nippon Budo Kyokai only recognize us. But that doesn't mean to say someone else cannot make claims and practice.

    Quite funny as Kiyonaga once called me. Asked me to meet him on a motorway service car park. Wanted me to desert Soke and join him!

    Good luck to them.
    Last edited by hyaku; 24th March 2014 at 15:37.

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    I remember Aoki Kikuo soke from my years with Sekiguchi ryu. He left several different people practicing both HNIR and Sekiguchi ryu iaijutsu in various places.
    Paul Smith
    "Always keep the sharp side and the pointy end between you and your opponent"

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    Quote Originally Posted by hyaku View Post
    Nippon Budo Kyokai only recognize us.
    I'm a little confused by what you mean by this. May I ask for clarification?

    The Nippon Kobudo Kyokai lists both Iwami's line and the Noda-ha line as members.
    As demonstrated by the Shimogamo Jinja embu, the Hosokawa-ke group is a member of the Nihon Kobudo Shinkokai.

    It is my understanding that neither the Kyokai nor the Shinkokai "recognize" mainlines as such.
    Josh Reyer

    Swa sceal man don, žonne he ęt guše gengan ženceš longsumne lof, na ymb his lif cearaš. - The Beowulf Poet

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    It is my understanding that The Shinkokai is the older formation of Kyokai. They dont meet yearly any more.

    Kyokai has a rule of only one group of a particular Ryu. With us its always been a question of who needs who. The 10th Soke's opinion was, Its our Ryu, any hassle and we leave you as we don't really need you.

    I hate to get involved in the politics. God knows there are so few that practice anyway. It all goes against Musashi's Mu and philosophy. If we don't try to upholld that I see little point in practicing. The Ryu not only offers practice but a mindset t go with it within the founders writing.
    Hyakutake Colin

    All the best techniques are taught by survivors.


    http://www.hyoho.com

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    Quote Originally Posted by hyaku View Post
    It is my understanding that The Shinkokai is the older formation of Kyokai. They dont meet yearly any more.
    Okay, what do you mean by this? Because the Shinkokai, as the Shinkokai, holds embu every year at Meiji Jingu, Asakusa, Shimogamo Jinja, and Atsuta Jinja.

    Kyokai has a rule of only one group of a particular Ryu.
    And my question is, if this is true, why are Noda-ha Niten Ichiryu also members of the Kyokai? Which for that matter includes 3 groups of Yagyu Shingan Ryu, and two groups of Tenjin Shinyo Jujutsu.

    With us its always been a question of who needs who. The 10th Soke's opinion was, Its our Ryu, any hassle and we leave you as we don't really need you.
    Well, yes. I doubt there are any member ryu of either the Kyokai or the Shinkokai who feel any differently.
    Josh Reyer

    Swa sceal man don, žonne he ęt guše gengan ženceš longsumne lof, na ymb his lif cearaš. - The Beowulf Poet

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