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Thread: RE: Distance and timing...

  1. #1
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    But when noticing kenjutsu the sword cuts are to open and slow.

    ==>speed is not the key in executing sword cuts/techniques. If you use speed to try to overcome an opponent, you will only be able to compete with those who play "speed games."

    In all martial arts, armed or unarmed, what is far more important than speed is your distance and timing. If you have not grasped these fundamental principles then you are doing your self a great disservice.

    Which is the same with all Japanese sword fighting. It tends to be easily dodged and avoided.

    ==>When practicing techniques in class, with full knowledge of what attack is coming, in a safe environment, and with an opponent not delivering a skilled and forceful attack this would be true.

    Get in a fight with a Chinese Kung Fu swordsman better watch out.

    ==>Curious what school of Kung Fu you are referring to?

    I have nothing bad about the Japanese swords, or arts because I am currently training in he Bujinkan but it just seems that way.

    ==>I to am part of that organization, and several Ryu ha have sword kata and techniques. Have you ever seen Soke, or Manaka performing sword techniques? If so I think you would change your mind.

    Perhaps the biggest thing you are having trouble with is assuming that the basic, fundamental training you are doing in your first few years of training is "real life fighting."

    In the beginning attacks are going to be slow and awkward, else you would get your head split from a bokken. Eventually you will progress to a lvl where you will have a chance to more accurately gauge the strengths and weaknesses of various schools of swordsmanship.

    Lance Boggs
    Lance Boggs
    _____________________

    "The man who can most truly be accounted brave is he who best knows the meaning of what is sweet in life and what is terrible, and then goes out undeterred to meet what is to come."

    Pericles

  2. #2
    Gordon Smith Guest

    Default IMHO...

    I tend to learn things slowly so that I may work on the perfection of form, intent, and timing (in both karate and iai, BTW). As I get a better grip on the concepts, then I start to increase the overall speed of the technique.

    This, I feel, is even more important in swordwork than in empty handed arts, as the first and fundamental lesson you learn is "always assume your weapon is sharpSharpSHARP." I switched to a live blade earlier than I should've, and am considering going back to an iaito. Why? Because my technique is not developed enough that I nibble away at my saya, and I have cut myself several times. Each time I learn a lesson, and try to take it to heart.

    Unfortunately, with the new wife and the new job, my practice time has suffered, and I feel I am backsliding a bit. I need to spend more time practicing, and the need for an iai-balance is becoming more and more evident.

    Yes, formal kate are slower than real-time action. But you strive for the techniques and muscle memory at half speed (ending with the fastest technique possible) in the hopes that the 50% you get in a "real" fight continually improves.

    Technique always suffers at higher speeds. Only practicing techniques at high speed limits the skill you can internalize.

    As for kung fu swordwork, can someone tell me if the edge is sharp or the point? Do KF practitioners practice with live blades, or mockups?

    -G-

  3. #3
    Daniel Pokorny Guest

    Default Whats this mean?

    Originally posted by Sillal

    Perhaps the biggest thing you are having trouble with is assuming that the basic, fundamental training you are doing in your first few years of training is "real life fighting."

    In the beginning attacks are going to be slow and awkward, else you would get your head split from a bokken. Eventually you will progress to a lvl where you will have a chance to more accurately gauge the strengths and weaknesses of various schools of swordsmanship.

    Lance Boggs [/B]
    Lance,

    All due respect guy, are you really contemplating a "real life fight" with a sword? C'mon! I train in Iaijutsu five days a week, but I have no delusions of an actual "real life fight". In todays world, I don't want to be the one bringing a three foot knife to a gun fight........

    Another issue here is just how long have you been doing sword? You must be over a 100 years old to be so efficient in "various schools of swordsmanship" that you can gauge whether one style is actually more effecient than another. Do you actually realize the amount of training that's required to make a statement like that? Now I am curious, what is your sword training background and who are your senseis?

    Dan P. - Mongo

  4. #4
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    Question ???

    ***All due respect guy, are you really contemplating a "real life fight" with a sword? C'mon! I train in Iaijutsu five days a week, but I have no delusions of an actual "real life fight". In todays world, I don't want to be the one bringing a three foot knife to a gun fight........ ***

    ==>I was responding to a thread initiated by someone else, that seems to have been moved to a thread of its own. Perhaps its the lack of the other posts in that thread that has caused our confusion.

    That said, I never pick up a weapon to train with without some thought or intention that it could be used for self defense. This applies to my Glock, my boken, and even my practice katana.

    Now I might never be confronted with a sword wielding maniac in a movie style fight, I might be called upon to use tools that are in my home to defend myself and my family.


    ***Another issue here is just how long have you been doing sword? You must be over a 100 years old to be so efficient in "various schools of swordsmanship" that you can gauge whether one style is actually more effecient than another. ***

    ==>I have never made comment on the effectiveness of one school over another. Again it was my intention to respond to a gentleman who had some concerns that traditional japanese sword techniques were slow and easilly dodged.

    Also my full quote was:

    "Eventually you will progress to a lvl where you will have a chance to more accurately gauge the strengths and weaknesses of various schools of swordsmanship. "

    Nowhere in this sentence can it be interpreted that I am trying to gauge anything, or that I am a master of various schools. It was simply a suggestion that if the gentleman I was responding to trained dilegently he would progress to a point where he would be able to more accuratly make statements such as:


    ***"Which is the same with all Japanese sword fighting. It tends to be easily dodged and avoided. "***


    Do you actually realize the amount of training that's required to make a statement like that?

    ==>Yes.
    Lance Boggs
    _____________________

    "The man who can most truly be accounted brave is he who best knows the meaning of what is sweet in life and what is terrible, and then goes out undeterred to meet what is to come."

    Pericles

  5. #5
    Daniel Pokorny Guest

    Default

    Sillal,

    Please accept my apologies as I did not see the original post. It's not good to only catch the middle of one of these threads........ if you look at the point I came in, it really sounded strange.....


    Humble bow while backing out the door one eye on you and the other on the floor! .......

    Regards,
    Dan P. - Mongo

  6. #6
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    Default No problem...

    Its no problem, I think I hit the button to post new topic instead of to reply within the thread I was reading. Sorry for the mixup

    Lance Boggs
    Lance Boggs
    _____________________

    "The man who can most truly be accounted brave is he who best knows the meaning of what is sweet in life and what is terrible, and then goes out undeterred to meet what is to come."

    Pericles

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