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Thread: Yoshida Kotaro & Yoshida Kenji (Yanagi-ryu)

  1. #31
    Dan Harden Guest

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    If I'm not mistaken the reference to Kotaro in Mas's book is more of a one liner on the order of "to my greatest teacher" or "to one of the greatest Artists" or some such thing. I do not remember any refernce to either DR, Yanagi by name or even any reference to a family art at all. Which of course fits in well with typical DR (fight club) demeaner; "Don't talk about it" and "No show!"

    I'll have to dig the book out to check.

    Dan
    back to work

  2. #32
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    [Post deleted by user]
    Last edited by Nathan Scott; 12th June 2014 at 04:57.
    Nathan Scott
    Nichigetsukai

    "Put strength into your practice, and avoid conceit. It is easy enough to understand a strategy and guard against it after the matter has already been settled, but the reason an opponent becomes defeated is because they didn't learn of it ahead of time. This is the nature of secret matters. That which is kept hidden is what we call the Flower."

    - Zeami Motokiyo, 1418 (Fūshikaden)

  3. #33
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    Default Kenji Yoshida quote

    I found an article that paraphrases a quote by Kenji Yoshida. Does anybody know the EXACT form of the following quote in english and/or japanese?

    "To paraphrase a quote from Yoshida Kenji Sensei, 'I do not look to authority for truth (reality), but look to truth (reality) for authority'."

    Here's where I found it:

    Martial Aiki - Past and Present
    Written by James Williams
    An excerpt from an article published in the Aikido JOURNAL
    http://www.aikidofaq.com/essays/martial_aiki.html



    thanks
    Matt Ashley

  4. #34
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    This quote is one of my favorites. It illustrates a powerful distinction (imo) that more people ought to make in all areas of life, but so often don't.

    Brently Keen

  5. #35
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    If you leave out the (reality) parts then the quote is accurate.
    It was said to a young Don Angier during his time as a student with Yoshida Kenji.
    Richard Elias
    Takamura-ha Shindo Yoshin ryu
    Yanagi Ryu

  6. #36
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    It's a good article too, definitely recommended reading.

    Brently Keen

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    "However, its purpose was to give historical background to why Kotaro Yoshida, descendant from Satsuma Samurai ended up in Sendai"

    Actually Yoshida Kotaro was known to travel around quite a bit and lived in several different locations throughout his life including Kiatmi, Ibaragi, Tokyo and others. He is also believe to have possibly traveled to China at some point. He may have originally gone to Sendai for education, it is where he attended the Tohoku Gakuin and graduated in 1906.
    Richard Elias
    Takamura-ha Shindo Yoshin ryu
    Yanagi Ryu

  8. #38
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    Default Question about Yoshida Kenji

    Sorry to resurrect this old thread when everyone else seems to have gotten what they needed from it; however. . .

    A character by the name of John Denora over at Budoseek is asserting that Yoshida Kenji died as a child in an internment camp in Arizona during World War II and had no connection with Angier sensei. He also states that photographs purporting to be of Yoshida Kenji in Angier's possession have been altered.

    My overall assessment of Denora over the last couple of months of seeing his posts in other fora there is that he's a bit, um, eccentric. I'm trying to be nice and not say "nutball".

    I'm trying to draw him out and get him to say who he thinks Angier sensei might have learned from if not Yoshida, but so far he doesn't seem to want to go there.

    So -- I'd like to know what some of you who may be more knowledgeable in this area think.

    This issue came up in a thread in Budoseek's Hapkido form exploring possible connections between Daito ryu and Hapkido, with the initial poster suggesting Yoshida Kotaro (rather than Takeda Sokaku) as the Daito ryu source.

    The thread is here.
    One who claims to have thoroughly learned his master's techniques while disregarding his master's teaching, relying instead on his own talents, is worse than a fool.

    -- Yamaoka Tesshu

  9. #39
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    In regards to the photos of Yoshida Kenji that Mr. Denora claims to be fabrications.
    I was a personal student of Don Angier’s and have personally handled the photos in question. They are in fact very real and produced at a time long before digital technology was available. They have since then been digitized and repaired of damage done over time, creases, folds, tears, and pen marks. But the originals still exist. I myself have scanned-in copies of some of the originals in my computer and the repaired versions. Don Angier has in his position several pictures of Yoshida Kenji from here in the states and in Japan, and from Kenji’s youth. He also has photos of Yoshida Kotaro… all originals mind you, not copies or digital creations. Additionally, I have also handled the original of the earlier posted photo, and it too is real.


    I also posted the above statement on Budoseek.
    Richard Elias
    Takamura-ha Shindo Yoshin ryu
    Yanagi Ryu

  10. #40
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    Oh and by the way... Thanks Dale
    Richard Elias
    Takamura-ha Shindo Yoshin ryu
    Yanagi Ryu

  11. #41
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    Dale,

    How are you doing? It has been a long time since we have had an opportunity to speak. I have stayed out of some of the threads in regards to John Denora on this forum even though I am very familiar with him, his claims, and his eccentricities, to be polite.

    It appears at this point in his life John is at best a huckster and at worst a liar and perhaps not fully competent mentally. He has no idea what he is saying about Yoshida Kenji and has no facts to back up these false claims.

    Regards,

    James
    James Willliams
    Kaicho
    Nami ryu

  12. #42
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    Dale,

    How are you doing? It has been a long time since we have had an opportunity to speak. I have stayed out of some of the threads in regards to John Denora on this forum even though I am very familiar with him, his claims, and his eccentricities, to be polite.

    It appears at this point in his life John is at best a huckster and at worst a liar and perhaps not fully competent mentally. He has no idea what he is saying about Yoshida Kenji and has no facts to back up these false claims.

    Regards,

    James
    James Willliams
    Kaicho
    Nami ryu

  13. #43
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    Originally posted by Richard Elias
    Oh and by the way... Thanks Dale
    You're most welcome, Richard.

    James, nice to see you here! I'm doing well. Was back to Japan a few weeks ago for Hatsumi's (72nd) birthday celebration and training; like Angier sensei he seems to just get spookier every year.

    BTW, my post over on Budoseek! asking Denora about where Angier could have learned his art of not from Yoshida was this:

    Originally posted by johenora


    -----
    Dear Mr. Dale Seago:
    Your comments are well taken. What martial art do you practice?
    Bujinkan Budo Taijutsu, for twenty years now -- I was one of the first 20 Americans to pass the 5th-dan test and be certified as an instructor, and I'm still very much a student of Hatsumi sensei.

    I do have some background in Korean arts: the first art in which I ever received a black belt (December '69) was the form of Tae Kwon Do being taught to the Korean military at the time. In the mid-'70s, I also trained in Hapkido for a while under Han, Bong Soo in southern California. I've also spent a fair amount of time on special-operations missions in Korea (late '80s) physically "comparing notes" re: Bujinkan/Korean martial arts in my free time with South Korean special forces officers I was working with.

    I have no direct experience in Daito ryu (more's the pity), but I have known Don Angier for. . .must be sixteen years now. I was introduced by a police-officer friend and student of mine who knew him. Back in those days Angier sensei would fly up to San Francisco and spend a weekend training with me and my group, literally for just the cost of the plane ticket to get him here. I've trained with him a fair number of times over the years, as have a number of my students: he still comes up here now and then for seminars, and we attend when we can. Many's the time I've tried my best to punch his head off or grab him and take him down, only to find myself airborne and laughing, because I had no sensory data to give me any clue as to how I got there.

    I've never made any attempt to learn his art as such. But there are so many principles in his which are also used (but manifest somewhat differently) in Hatsumi sensei's budo that I find the difference in perspective and approach helps to illuminate the principles themselves. Indeed, I owe him a considerable debt for "giving me the eyes to see" a lot of what Hatsumi sensei was doing in my early years, at a time when Hatsumi wasn't really explaining things much.

    Hence my interest in this thread. If Angier sensei did not learn from Kenji Yoshida as he claims, he certainly learned something from somewhere. . .
    He still hasn't answered in his subsequent posts, nor addressed Richard's comments about the photos either.

    BTW, I should mention that nowadays I also "have the eyes to see" what's going on with the more exotic-looking Systema stuff -- so I was happy to see a couple of my folks head down your way for a Systema seminar last year. They reported that they had a great time.
    One who claims to have thoroughly learned his master's techniques while disregarding his master's teaching, relying instead on his own talents, is worse than a fool.

    -- Yamaoka Tesshu

  14. #44
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    Dale,

    It was good to see your bunch attend the seminar in February. Good bunch of folks
    Systema

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    Default Denora & Budoseek

    [Post deleted by user]
    Last edited by Nathan Scott; 12th June 2014 at 04:58.
    Nathan Scott
    Nichigetsukai

    "Put strength into your practice, and avoid conceit. It is easy enough to understand a strategy and guard against it after the matter has already been settled, but the reason an opponent becomes defeated is because they didn't learn of it ahead of time. This is the nature of secret matters. That which is kept hidden is what we call the Flower."

    - Zeami Motokiyo, 1418 (Fūshikaden)

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