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Thread: Katori Shinto ryu jujutsu

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    Question Katori Shinto ryu Jujutsu

    Hi,

    Is there anybody out there who still practices the Katori Shinto Ryu Jujutsu?. During a recent conversation with Hatakeyama Sensei, he told me that he no longer Teaches the TSKSR Jujutsu.
    Are these true Katori Shinto ryu Jujutsu techniques, or something that has been added by Sugino Sensei. Also, if they are true Katori Jujutsu techniques, does Otake sensei still teach them?


    All the best
    Brian Carpenter

    Haruchi Umuchi Tsuzuchi !

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    I saw on a Japanese TV show on koryu which showed Otake Risuke showing jujutsu. I believe the show was done around 1996-1998.

    It is the same show that had Katori Shinto ryu, Taisha ryu, Jigen ryu, Takenouchi ryu (Tojuro), Daito ryu (Kondo), and I believe Kobori ryu tosuijutsu.
    George Kohler

    Genbukan Kusakage dojo
    Dojo-cho

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    Wink

    Mmmm.... interesting, thanks George, I wonder if Otake Sensei still teaches the Jujutsu.
    I think I read somewhere that there are 36 Jujutsu techniques in the. TSKSR.
    There`s a guy over in Ireland who claims to have trained under Otake, Sugino and Hatakeyama Sensei, and is selling video`s of TSKSR. One of the video`s is supposedly of TSKSR Jujutsu. I would get a copy, but at £150, it seems a little bit expensive.

    yours
    Brian Carpenter

    Haruchi Umuchi Tsuzuchi !

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    Hi all,

    Sugino sensei has written a book on TSKSR, somewhere in the '30's or 40's I think. The names of the jujutsu techniques are listed in it - there are indeed 36 of them.
    I asked Hatakeyama sensei many years ago about those techniques, he showed two or three moves but I don't think it was TSKSR. I seem to remember that he has learned some style of jujutsu before studying TSKSR.

    Best Regards,

    Johan Smits

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    From what i understand,the TSKSR jujutsu techniques were meant specifically for men in armour on the battlefield.
    So there seems to be little use for them,but since they are part of the Ryu's history i'm convinced Shihan Otake knows them.
    If anyone knows more about this,please tell,interesting stuff
    Len van der Wolf

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    I don't know if this helps any, but I recently purchased a copy of "Old School" by Ellis Amdur. I just finished reading the chapter on TSKSR (the first chapter to boot) and while he mentions little about the "jujutsu" portion of TSKSR he mentions that it's termed yawara-ge and that it focuses mostly on arms length joint locking rather than close in grappling. The rest of the chapter doesn't mention much on it but he gives no indication that it is no longer practiced. In fact, the yawara-ge is in a list of fighting arts that he states are taught by TSKSR. So I'd say that they're alive and well.

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    Anthony,
    Thanks for that info,i'm going to try and get a copy of the book you mentioned.
    Regards.
    Len van der Wolf

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    Hi all!
    And somebody, saw film or the book where show: Gokui no bo Secret techniques 5 kajo, Gokui hichijo no naginata Secret techniques 3 kajo and Suriken-jutsu? I have films Yosio Sugino, and Otake Risuke, and Tetsutaka Sugawara, but nobody shows these tehniks.

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    Originally posted by Moriki
    There`s a guy over in Ireland who claims to have trained under Otake, Sugino and Hatakeyama Sensei, and is selling video`s of TSKSR.
    Could you post his name? There are some frauds about who make all kinds of claims on training under these three masters.

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    hello all,

    There was a documentary series made by the BBC a few years ago (1980's?) that has Otake sensei on it ("Way of the Warrior" maybe?). He showed a lot of different kata from the ryu including sword, spear and naginata. He even gave a basic run down of how a warrior should build his house/castle (very feng shui like) and how to deal with fox spirits. If memory serves they mentioned that there is jujutsu but that they would not show it because it was simple to learn even from watching and very dangerous if replicated without a qualified instructor. I would imagine without the inner secrets the weapons kata were far less dangerous to show, and less likely to be understood by outsiders.

    If you have the three book set by Draeger (Classical Bujutsu, Classical Budo, and Modern Bujutsu and Budo) there are a few pictures of the jujutsu techniques.

    Hope this helps.

    peace,
    Christopher Covington

    Daito-ryu aikijujutsu
    Kashima Shinden Jikishinkage-ryu heiho

    All views expressed here are my own and don't necessarily represent the views of the arts I practice, the teachers and people I train with or any dojo I train in.

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    Hi all,

    I seem to recall that it was mentioned somewhere on the net that the techniques shown by Otake sensei in the book by Draeger aren't KSR (Jikiden or Muso Jikiden or so... I really don't remember but it was one with authority).
    But then nothing is KSR outside Japan (except for two legitimit representatives I believe).

    I do wonder about something concerning KSR jujutsu. From memory the jujutsu is a part of the ura teachings of the school. I was under the impression that the ura parts were pretty important in koryu. Essence of the style found there so to speak.
    So why would something that may have been added later to the school become a part of the ura teachings?

    But then who cares?

    Best Regards,

    Johan Smits

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    My teachers told me that in Sugino dojo (this was in the mid-90s), they used to get together about once a year to practice the ju jutsu techniques. A senior student (Iwata-san) would read the technical descriptions aloud, and the other students would do them. They would do them one by one, having lots of laughs and a good time.

    Afterwards, it was food and sake :-)

    They described the techniques as being somewhat archaic and very basic. I think one of my teachers said something about other styles of ju jutsu had developed since these were made. The techniques were looked on as anachronisms and something to preserve. Technically, however, their time had passed long ago, he said (and he's a 5. dan in "modern" ju jutsu).

    I've tried to get them to show them to me, but I guess it won't be until I go to Japan that I'll have the opportunity. I forgot to ask Sugino sensei about this when he was in Norway. I was too excited about him showing me the basics of shuriken jutsu :-)
    Yours friendly,

    K. Sandven


    Blog: My Life In Budo

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    Hi Kristoffer,

    That is a great story!

    If you have the chance (and permission) take pictures or videotape the techniques. A lot of people are very interested in Katori Shinto-ryu jujutsu.

    The fact that the techniques are archaic does not make them less interesting in my opinion. Nice blog by the way.

    Best regards,

    Johan Smits

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    I was going through some old video tapes a few days ago and found one on a Japanese tv show about budo where these young people go and do little expose’ on various different ryu including Daito ryu, Taisha ryu, Negishi ryu, and Katori ryu. During the Katori ryu portion Otake sensei demonstrates a couple of the yawara techniques. Vary basic stuff from wrist grab and from an ear or hair grab. If I recall correctly they are probably the same ones depicted in Don Draeger’s book.
    Richard Elias
    Takamura-ha Shindo Yoshin ryu
    Yanagi Ryu

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    Dear Richard,

    Would it be possible to get a copy of that tape from you? As in someone who is interested pays you a (not ungodly) amount of money and receives a copy?

    Please say yes? - and make my day!

    Best regards,

    Johan Smits

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