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Thread: Cayce, SC incident caught on dashcam with good sound recording too.

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    Default Cayce, SC incident caught on dashcam with good sound recording too.

    I do not know the context of what initiated the encounter.

    As for what is on the footage, the Sergeant seems to be conducting himself with a good deal of consideration for the subject and professionalism.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hGQqK9nmPWg

    If I was to Monday morning quarterback the incident, the presence of the knife on the floor of the vehicle might have led to a quicker pre-emptive cuffing but the Sergeant did not yet have cover and I can see that he was trying to keep things cool with the subject while he sorted things out and waited for cover. Seems to me that he communicated clearly, and kept up a respectful dialogue while obviously being lied to. I would like to hear what the LEOs on here think.

    It is sad to see a young man go down that way. You can really see how bad decisions on his part took on momentum. After making the choice to carry the gun one bad decision led to progressively worse ones as I imagine he didn't want to catch a felony charge on the gun so he ends up shooting at two cops.
    Al Heinemann
    www.shofukan.ca

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    Well, first off, it will be reported vastly differently in the media and by the activist community. I'm sure we will see another pasted article devoid of informed, personal opinion on that here as well.

    Tactically, not a lot of good control there, but that isn't unusual. The disengage was actually a wise move. Lots of stress going on, obvious from the high pitched screaming and lack of breathing, but these guys were in the fight of their lives.
    Kit Leblanc

    In Harm's Way

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    Quote Originally Posted by Hissho View Post
    Tactically, not a lot of good control there, but that isn't unusual. The disengage was actually a wise move. Lots of stress going on, obvious from the high pitched screaming and lack of breathing, but these guys were in the fight of their lives.
    Certainly not enough control to prevent him from drawing and firing.

    A positive take away: those officers both kept fighting after being shot/shot at and at no point gave up the fight (once they knew the fight was on), something we hear on e-budo frequently
    Al Heinemann
    www.shofukan.ca

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    Quote Originally Posted by Hissho View Post
    Well, first off, it will be reported vastly differently in the media and by the activist community. I'm sure we will see another pasted article devoid of informed, personal opinion on that here as well.
    And I have no doubt that when the public expresses concern about where the system has taken us, and occasionally presents some of those concerns, we'll be presented with yet another storm of indignant words that boil down to the same thing each and every time.

    Nullius in verba

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    Allan

    I was talking with another trainer on this and his assessment was pretty good - what you see is ineffective control holds (one officer appears to be attempting a "gooseneck" wrist lock) that pretty much only work on compliant people as low level control for cuffing, and for semi-compliant but non-resistive drunks (again as come alongs or prior to cuffing...)

    And when those don't work, they have nothing else to go to...

    That is one of the big concerns vis-a-vis the comments in these posts on training - ineffective methods are culled from symbolic martial studies, very little adaptation is done, and very little actual time on target to garner the reps to make them effective occur. And that's in the departments who actually do train. Many do almost no post academy hands on training.

    Maintaining enough control to first prevent the gun being accessed requires a much greater level of skill and experience in resistive work. That just doesn't happen for most officers. The next step cops have is usually repeated striking, which is usually not very effective, offers very little in the way of controlling weapons access, and looks awful on video. Disengaging and keeping moving was probably the best move.
    Kit Leblanc

    In Harm's Way

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